Pro vs. con view
1031 arguments retrieved in 3.0 ms

PRO

  • PRO

    I shall be presenting two positive line of arguments. ......

    Feminism

    I thank my opponent for instigating this debate. Definition(s): 1. Feminism: "Feminism is a collection of movements and ideologies aimed at defining, establishing, and defending equal political, economic, cultural, and social rights for women."[1][2] Premise: There has been, and still is, a prejudice against certain people. These prejudices have resulted in much abuse, but the female sex has been abused, and mistreated more than many others. It was not until 1919 until women were allowed to vote, and were considered equal in the eyes of the law[3], it was only in 1993 that the United Nations first passed a resolution for the protection of women rights[4], and despite this even today women are abused, beaten, and have to face glass ceilings.[5] Stance: I will be advocating for Feminism as a positive philosophy where feminism is the belief that women, and men should be treated equally in all formal respects such as law, merit of job, education, et cetera. I will attempt to show that my opponent has a misguided understanding of feminism, and has no basis nor proof of the statistics he cites. I shall be presenting two positive line of arguments. 1. All Are Born Equal 2. Women Are Yet Mistreated LOA1: All Are Born Equal "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." -Declaration of Independence Even here the word "man" is used. This may seem to be a "free doctrine" when in fact here "man" is not gender neutral, and does not apply to dark skinned men, or women. In fact this only applied to white men. Even in one of the greatest documents of history, one finds prejudice. Though the document does get one thing right: that each person is born with inalienable rights, and all are equal. Including women, girls, or members of the femine gender. Women are also sentient creatures, and possess the same cognitive abilities, reasoning capacities, as men. Thus we asert that women are in fact equal to men, and it would be much perverted of our opponent to disagree and state that women are in any view "inferior" At this point we have won this debate. For so long as the belief that women and men are equal is prevalent the philosophy that they should be treated equally is naturally acceptable. That is truly what feminism is, not a doctrine which states that women are superior to men, or exactly the same (after all there are biological differences), but rather that women have the right to be treated equally in formal matters. They should be entitled to the same court benefits, the right to vote, the same education, the same salary, and the same treatment as men of equal caliber. I shall be giving my second line of argument, and my refutations in the following second round for lack of time. My internet connection was having issues, I apologize. [1]http://tinyurl.com... [2]http://tinyurl.com... [3]http://tinyurl.com... [4]http://tinyurl.com... [5]Ibidem -Theo

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/7/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.68
      feminism: 24.68
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 9.29 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.57)
      sourceText: 1.95 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.09)
  • PRO

    Feminism in it's current form is a terrible sexist...

    Feminism is Wrong

    Open to anyone. Start the debate right away. He we gooo! Feminism in it's current form is a terrible sexist movement that needs to die a quick and painful death. First wave Feminism in it's current form is a terrible sexist movement that needs to die a quick and painful death. First wave feminism was about gaining equal rights. Second wave feminism was about gaining respect. Third wave intersectional feminism is not about those ideals. It is about making women superior to men.

  • PRO

    Then my opponent's response would have been something...

    Feminism is not sexist.

    I thank my opponent for his rebuttal. My rebuttal will address both Round 2 and Round 3. My opponent started his rebuttal by accusing me of basing my argument on the definition of feminism... I plead guilty as charged, but I fail to see how this is a problem. My opponent then clarifies by saying that I excluded how feminism is applied in the real world. Let met be clear about something: if the topic of the debate was 'Sexism is sometimes used by people who consider themselves feminists', then I would have sided with Pro and there would be no debate. But the topic addresses the IDEA of feminism. Let me make an analogy to express this: Let's say the topic was 'Atheism is a violent ideology' and that I argued that atheism has nothing to do violence. Then my opponent's response would have been something like 'Well look at the Soviet Union who killed millions of people in the name of atheism'... The fact that someone used atheism as an excuse to do violent things does not mean that atheism is a violent ideology, in the same sense that people using feminism in a sexist way does not make feminism sexist. Now let's see what my opponent means when he says that feminism is sexist. In both Round 2 and Round 3 my opponent points to the VAWA to illustrate how feminism is sexist. Even if I was to concede that the VAWA is sexist, it is absolutely irrelevant to the topic of the debate; feminism is not 'the support of VAWA', pointing to a so-called sexist law (I would have to do more research to find out if it is actually sexist) does not make feminism sexist any way. In Round 2, my opponent accuses feminism of 'allowing the Draft and Selective Service to only affect men'. That is a pretty weak argument; saying that feminism is sexist because it did not do anything to prevent a certain law would make basically any ideology who did not say anything about it sexist as well. Atheism is not against that law either, is atheism sexist? 'Why do I bring up the Draft and Selective Service? I bring it up because Feminism is supposedly a movement to support gender equality, but it chooses to only support those things that benefit women (voting), over those things that would harm them (compulsory public service). While i would not suggest women should be conscripted when the need arises, I am arguing that there should be a similar system by which women must buy their right to vote.' I am really having trouble understanding what my opponent means, is he saying that women should invent a useless law just to make sure that they have something to do before they can vote? 'PRO also argues that feminism is the key to eliminating stereotypes. I am not convinced. Even basic stereotypes against women carry a corollary stereotype against men.' I agree with the last part, but how is that an argument in favor of my opponent? Wouldn't getting rid of stereotypes against women also rid us of some stereotypes against men? In a nut shell, Con's argument is that since there are some aspects in society that favor women, feminism must be sexist. That is a non-sequitur and an unfair association. I hope that my opponent can provide me with adequate evidence that supports the assertion that feminism is sexist.

  • PRO

    That point being paternity leave for either parent, Equal...

    Feminism

    I accept your challenge, And I know this is truly going to be a challenge. I will argue that feminism is good to a point. That point being paternity leave for either parent, Equal opportunities in ALL FIELDS, Draft reform focusing around families and relationships protections, Equal treatment in the streets (such as: rape jokes are bad no matter who is the subject) and finally, Proven reasons for a gap in wage or no gap at all. I am against some feminism, Primarily the radicals, The 'victims' and the idiots. Women should be exactly equal to men. If you have lower wage and work less, Work harder for a better wage. I want to admit, I am a noob, And I do not have a history of using sources, But I will do my best. Also, For clarification, "In all forms" do you mean including women's suffrage? Here we go. . .

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/34/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.63
      feminism: 24.63
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 9.20 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.56)
      sourceText: 1.99 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.12)
  • PRO

    There will always be people who mis represent the groups...

    Feminism

    That is not only sexist, but also wrong. We still live in a world where women are not paid as much as men. We still live in a world where women are victims of rape. Not a few of them, not tens or hundreds of them, but thousands upon thousands. We still live in a world where single mothers are denied jobs and looked down upon, and when they do find a way to support their children, they are still judged by the society they are members of. So what do you want women to do? Stop fighting for what we deserve? Equal pay, respect, safety, the ability to live our lives the way we want to? There are countless examples of instances, laws, and events that still undermine women's rights in the present. Women deserve to live as equals to men and feminism is how that equality is created. Feminism is not poisoning the minds of women, hostility and fear are poisoning the minds of people like you. Being a feminist does not mean hating men, or using violence and hatred to break those who are not feminists apart. Being a feminist is simple; it is actively advocating for the rights of women. Feminism is what allowed for people like Malala Yousafzai to liberate herself from oppression and not only receive an education, but a voice that affected millions of young girls worldwide. Feminism allowed Oprah Winfrey to become one of the most successful American entrepreneurs in history and create an empire that charitable and ethical. For crying out loud, simply google famous feminists and you will find not only some of the most impressive women in history, but some of the most ridiculous obstacles placed in their way. Modern feminism is just as important as feminism of, say, the suffrage era. When will we ever be truly equal if people can say things like "Good is good enough, the wage gap isn't that big" or when politicians can make blatantly offensive comments directed at the female gender and not be held accountable? It may seem like there is no need for the fight to continue, and that women are where they want to be, but that is false. That is one of the reasons I imagine you would begin this debate; because you do not believe it is necessary. The second reason is that you possibly have had a bad experience with a feminist. With every philosophical group, especially groups related to theology, there are always sub groups referred to as extremists. The most notable example being Islamic extremists such as ISIS, who aren't even correctly identified seeing as they do not practice that faith in it's essence. The point is, not every Muslim is a terrorist in the same way not every feminist is a male hating, propaganda spewing monster that many men claim them to be. There will always be people who mis represent the groups they are associated with, but if we continue to react violently and curse what the group stands for on the basis of a fraction of their supporters, we will all lose. The third and final reason I would guess this turned into a debate is that you are sexist, and I really hope this is not the case. Because I know for a fact you have or have had a woman in your life; a mother at least, possibly a sister, aunt, cousin, friend, girlfriend, whoever. And I know that you probably love this (or these) women and would hate to see them trampled on by the community they live in. So what I'm really saying is, if you believe like I do that they deserve to be treated and seen as the beautiful, strong, and independent people they are by the rest of the world, then you too are a feminist.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/19/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.62
      feminism: 24.62
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 9.29 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.57)
      sourceText: 1.90 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.03)
  • PRO

    One may be tempted to say that it is slightly...

    Feminism is not sexist.

    I would like to thank my opponent for his last round. My opponent starts by saying that the definition of feminism assumes that 'women have rights that are not equal to men's, and given this, it is necessary to advocate for them'. I agree with my opponent AND with the assumption. He then points out the fact that presume that 'women's right' are the same as 'human rights'... once again I plead guilty as charged and I hope I'm not the only one who does; in my opinion women ARE human and therefore women's right ARE human rights. I'm surprised that this is even an issue and that is why I didn't consider it important to provide an explanation. Then my opponent goes on to say that since feminism focuses on women's right, it necessarily follows that it is sexist. Well, according to the definition of sexism provided by CON, it does not follow. Focusing one's efforts on making sure that women have equal rights is neither prejudicial nor stereotyping. One may be tempted to say that it is slightly discriminating, but it isn't either; feminism does not strive to eradicate or diminish men's right, it strives to make women equal to men in terms of rights. My opponent then reiterates his explanation for connecting the laws he presented with feminism: "The reason why this is crucial to my arguments, and truly this whole debate, is that it leads to the support of laws that are made to support women's rights. Such things as protection under the law and voting are some rights that can be, and have been, advocated for. As such, they fall into the realm of 'feminism'..." Yes, fighting for the right to vote is feminist because men had the right to vote when women didn't. But this has nothing to do with the laws he presented. 'PRO's attempt to argue that a law is only feminist if it supports the equal rights of men and women is flawed, as the only mention of equal rights of the sexes is in reference to justification for the advocacy of women's rights.' Yes, I argue that a law is only feminist if it falls into the definition of feminism, which I think is a pretty good way to assess it: if a law doesn't advocate women's right on the ground of the equality of sexes, then it isn't feminist. He then restates his explanation regarding the supposed weakness of my analogy, making the exact same mistake once more: he is comparing what atheism is with what feminism is, which was not all what I was trying to do. The analogy with taxes IS pointless for a reason that I have already addressed: pointing to sexist events or aspects of society (a non-existent one in this case) and associating them with feminism only because they favor women is purely a non-sequitur. In conclusion, my opponent's argument is basically that since there are laws that favor women over men, feminism must be sexist. He associates feminism with any law that favor women, disregarding the definition of feminism. As I have previously said, most of my opponent's arguments would have been great in a debate where the topic was 'Sexism is often used by people who claim to be feminist', but it isn't. As my opponent and I have both said, we are discussing the IDEA of feminism, and one cannot judge the pros and cons of an ideology by pointing to how it is used by people (for reasons I have previously explained). I would like to thank my opponent for this entertaining debate.

  • PRO

    3) Once feminism does fully succeed in the US and other...

    Feminism

    I would like to start my rebuttal by thanking my opponent for his opening arguments. I would also like to clarify that feminism is not an argument, it is a movement and a collection of ideologies. Now, my opponent makes the claim that feminism has already succeeded in making women equals, thus it no longer has a place in first world countries. I have a few things to say on this: 1) My opponent offers no data or sources that show equality. He claims women can be president now, yet we have not seen a female president yet. He claims women can join the army now, but yet they only represent 14.6% of the US military [1]. 2) Just because a movement has succeeded (which feminism has not yet fully accomplished, as I will show further on in this argument), that does not mean the movement should be shut down. Once goals are reached, it is still important to work to maintain the achievements that the movement fought for. 3) Once feminism does fully succeed in the US and other first world nations, the success of the movement can be used to help the third world countries that are much farther behind, as my opponent admits. Feminists should not (and do not) only aim to help women in their own countries; feminism is a global movement that aims to help equalize rights for all women. So if success is found in some areas, feminists can take that success elsewhere and look to help other women in need [2]. My opponent also makes the claim that he believes men are now subordinate. He again provides no data or sources for his claim; only that men are forced to fight in wars. This is an odd argument, given that earlier my opponent used the example of females finally being allowed to fight in the army as proof that equality exists, but then claims that men are the ones forced to fight in wars. If it is equal as you state and women are allowed in the army, that renders your second argument void because women are now allowed to fight as well. In reality, it is true that more men still fight and die for their country, but is that because they are subordinate or because for a long time, women were not permitted to do so? Now I want to provide some numbers that show why feminism has not yet fully succeeded in the United States. Women in the United States still make $0.77 to every $1.00 a man makes [3]. There can be many reasons for this gap, but it has been this way for some time and does not seem to be changing much. Many high paying professions may shy away from hiring women due to the potential for pregnancy and maternity leave. Many women may choose to work only part time jobs because their spouse already has a high paying job, and someone needs more time to look after the children. Whatever the reasons, the fact of the matter is, pretty much across the board, women don't make as much money as men do. Even childless women still only make 82% of what their male counterparts make, so pregnancy and maternity leave are not the only cause for this gap [4]. The fact is, in most occupations, a woman's salary is less than that of a man's in the same occupation [5]. My opponent's claim that feminism has already succeeded was not backed by any sources and I have just shown how gender equality still does not fully exist, even in the first world countries. I have also shown that even if feminists did succeed in achieving equality in the US and other first world countries, they still would have a role to play in maintaining the equality that they achieved as well as aiding in the feminist movements on a global scale. The feminist movement is necessary now and moving forward, to ensure that women are treated equally and can obtain and maintain equal rights in all countries across the globe. [1] http://www.statisticbrain.com... [2] http://www.umich.edu... [3] http://www.forbes.com... [4] http://www.aauw.org... [5] http://www.bls.gov...

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/3/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.24
      feminism: 24.24
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 8.82 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.50)
      sourceText: 1.98 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.12)
  • PRO

    Once again you are making generalizations about...

    Feminism

    Once again you are making generalizations about feminists. By definition feminism is: the advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic EQUALITY to men. See! Real feminists want equality, not to overpower men.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/12/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.17
      feminism: 24.17
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 8.73 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.48)
      sourceText: 2.00 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.14)
  • PRO

    Thank you for accepting my debate, these are my...

    Feminism is stupid

    Thank you for accepting my debate, these are my arguments: Feminism is irrelevant in the 21st century and the idea of its existence is stupid altogether and here's why: 1. Feminism is only recognizable in the First World countries where feminism is no longer needed. 2. Feminism rarely addresses issue that men also face, which is ironic considering feminism is created for the equality of both men and women. An example of this, is men dying in wars and in the wilderness. Most feminists don't want to admit that both men and women both suffer whether it maybe present or in the past 3. Women who call themselves feminist barely do anything besides constant whining. If they really do care about other women they would be fighting for other women's rights in third world countries. 4. All feminists blame the plight of women solely on men (aka "the patriarchy") and not various social and economic issues in society. 5. When you argue with a feminist they usually say "you don't know what its like to be a woman", instead of telling us the relevance of feminism in the modern age 6. Patriarchy is nonexistent. If it were to be true, women wouldn't have the ability to vote, drive, study, get jobs, or get abortions. 7. All feminists are almost always based on the individual's self-interests and not in actual gender equality. They want men to be subservient to women and use feminism as the way to achieve this goal. They want rights handed to them that would no longer benefit men, but do not want to get rid of the "traditional" gender roles that have benefited women. 8. The RICH have always held power, not men. In fact, basic human survival dictated women have always had to be more important than men, because men cannot get pregnant and continue the species. Women have always been more important than men, which is why women never had to fight in wars or do the laborious work in society, up until recently. 10. Feminists are sexist without even realizing it. They victimize women to the point one might think all women are handicapped weak and helpless frail members of society, when they are not. 11. Feminism has its own agenda of self-interest. 12. If you don't label yourself as such, you're apparently against them. Feminism loves to recruit and wage wars more than working towards a common goal. 13. Most women don't hate men (or see them as intellectual inferior and "not responsible for their own stupidity", or blame them for everything bad that happens to them), thus, couldn't be feminists. 14. Many feminists have double standards beyond just benefits and "privileges" in society. Call men stupid, weak, helpless, fools, and laugh at the idea of their penis getting chopped of by a psycho woman? Its okay to feminists, but don't you dare call a woman stupid, weak, helpless, fools, or laugh at the idea of female mutilation! 15. Feminism, as evidenced in its name is not about equal treatment towards the sexes and gender equality. Feminism, by definition, is the idea of working on the issues of women in order to gain "gender equality."

  • PRO

    We need feminism because if someone never told them they...

    Feminism is necessary

    Feminism is defined as "the advocacy of women's rights in the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men." So many people still wonder why we need feminism, why any woman in this day and age would call herself a feminist. The word itself has become a dirty word. Instead of seeing it as something good, the idea of feminism has been warped and shaped into something cruel and oppressive, something that supports abortion on demand. Feminists are seen as man haters and women who want to take over and eliminate men. Many still ask the question "Well why do you still need feminism? Women have the right to vote, go to school, own property, etc." We need feminism because if someone never told them they were wrong, men would always treat women as objects, like a subordinate, like property. Feminism is the fight against this. But that's over now, right? That's no longer necessary? We fought our war, but now we are done, right? Men have not evolved from their original nature. Men have not surpassed and outgrown their feeling of superiority over women. Every single thing a woman does is sexualized. Girls are sent home from school for wearing yoga pants because "It's distracting to the boys." Fifty year old men will cat call 12 year old girls on the street. Girls are taught to walk down the street with their key between their fingers in case they are attacked. In cases of rape, women are asked, "Well what were you wearing?" We are told "You must have been asking for it." Girls are taught to cover themselves up instead of teaching boys not to rape. According to the Institute for Women's Policy Research, "In 2014, female full-time workers made only 79 cents for every dollar earned by men, a gender wage gape of 21 percent." Feminism is not a hateful idea. Feminists are people who believe in equality of the sexes. Yes women have the right to vote and to own property. Yes we can go to college. But we are not yet treated equally. This is why feminism is 100% necessary.

CON

  • CON

    I'm new here, so I have no clue if this is the place to...

    Feminism

    I'm new here, so I have no clue if this is the place to say this or not. So I'm just going to wing it. You sir, have changed my mind. I concede this debate. I would however, like to point out, that he is correct in saying that I just don't like feminism. I do agree with feminist theory, and I can get behind many of the feminist points. However, I do not feel that this is truly what the feminist community holds to. In my experience, I have found that much of feminism has been about the "patriarchy" (I wont get into that) and seems to paint men as evil, and the reason behind the evil in our society. While it could easily be said that this has all been from the extremists, I have yet to run into a feminist who isn't an "extremist." Before I get incredibly off topic, I would like to thank my former adversary for breaking down feminism without an argument riddled with fallacies. That was the first time I've truly heard a legitimate counter argument to my points that wasn't riddled with red herrings, emotional appeal, straw men, and just overall ridiculous claims. I still do not agree with feminism, simply because I believe that instead of individual groups that focus on the rights of a certain gender, race, nationality, ect... we would be much stronger if we all united and fought for all human rights, where ever we are needed. I thank you Mikal for educating me.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/2/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.86
      feminism: 24.86
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 9.49 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.61)
      sourceText: 1.94 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.07)
  • CON

    Cancer: An abnormal growth of cells which tend to...

    Feminism is cancer

    Cancer: An abnormal growth of cells which tend to proliferate in an uncontrolled way and, in some cases, to metastasize (spread). http://www.medicinenet.com... Feminism: The advocacy of women's rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men. https://www.google.com... Is: Used as to describe equals. http://www.merriam-webster.com... By definitions, feminism does not equal cancer. Despite the horrendous consequences of these two disastrous things, feminism doesn't attack and kill the host's body, it destroys the host's brain cells as well as other people's not under the harshness of this plague. Furthermore, as my opponent admits, the difference between feminism and cancer is... Cancer can be cured, feminism can't and must be destroyed by means of fire.

  • CON

    I'm going to use Nietzsche here, Because the...

    Feminism

    The Case against Feminism There are many reasons to stand in opposition to Feminism, I will outline 5 below. 1. Anti-Egalitarian Misandry Often these two words get confused (Feminism and Egalitarianism). Feminism is not, And has never, Been about universal equal-treatment. In fact, There are many cases feminists will stand in opposition to male rights in order to bolster their own. This is especially evident in their vehement opposition and mischaracterization of the Men's Rights Movement. 2. Self-centred A wise, Blue-haired, Shrieking harpy-demon once told me: "Why is it always women that are expected to center everyone else"s issues in their movement? " Truly, I've never heard something so profound in it's implication. One may argue that since the feminist movement juxtaposes women against men, They do not care who they must step over to achieve a perceived state of "equality. " In other words - the leaders of the movement want power, And are willing to sacrifice empathy to obtain it. 3. Deconstructionism This is more a jab at the contemporary feminist movement. I'm going to use Nietzsche here, Because the postmodernists like him so much. Read: [1][2] In the same way a weakling may rationalize his weakness, The postmodernist rationalizes the failure of socialism. A smart man could never be fooled by such a rationalization, And this makes them angry. The truth is that American culture has always been gynocentric, And the postmodern feminists know this. This thought burns them deeply resulting in seething anger. The feminists regularly gleefully attack the foundational values to our society gleefully and use "sexism, " or "misogyny" as an excuse. This is the equivalent of saying: "I could never create something to rival your traditions, So I will attack what they value most. " 4. Hypocritical I'm not going to spend much time here as it's quite self-explanatory. A feminist expects us to respect them and their actions while behaving in obscene manners and disrespecting us. I will not respect you because of your genitalia - I will respect anyone unless given a reason to do otherwise. 5. Counterproductive As it turns out, The majority of women do not want to be soldiers, Firefighters, Bricklayers, Or scientists. In attempting to achieve equal representation they are stomping upon the ideals of females who have chosen to be caring mothers, Nurses, Or poets. When treated equally, Gender differences in choice widen. [3] A brief response Quote: "Also, For clarification, "In all forms" do you mean including women's suffrage? " Women's suffrage is not 'feminist, ' and it was the result of a shift in culture and subsequent advances a result of the introduction of birth control and other scientific advancements. Quote: "Women should be exactly equal to men. " No, They shouldn't because we aren't equal in many regards. I'll recommend in the next round you rephrase this to: "should be treated equally to men. " Quote: "I am against some feminism, Primarily the radicals, The 'victims' and the idiots. " I would say feminism in it's current state IS radical, And the majority of women aren't feminists. SOURCES [1-3] IN COMMENTS

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/34/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.71
      feminism: 24.71
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 9.29 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.57)
      sourceText: 1.99 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.12)
  • CON

    Feminism is what women want to make sure they are treated...

    Feminism is not pointless

    Sorry about my argument for the last round, apologies to Mr. Wanless for having his account closed. I will now present an argument in the hopes that Charlie_Danger's account is reopened. Feminism: a doctrine that advocates equal rights for women. [1] Pointless : [2] 1 : devoid of meaning : 2 : devoid of effectiveness The current idea of Feminism is pointless. In the 60s or 70s, Feminism did have a point, it did work to make voting rights for women etc., however Feminism as it is today, is pointless. The idea of Feminism defeats itself. Feminism is what women want to make sure they are treated equally as everyone else, however, they use Feminism as a tool to provide them with certain rights that no one else can have. These include inflated pay, etc., [3]. With this new breed of Feminism we have just created a group of misogynistic women who prefer double standards to men. In addition to this, there are some women who face unnecessary backlash from Feminists. These women are those who would prefer to stay at home with their children, who like being subservient to their husbands and who enjoy doing domestic work. Feminism is a doctrine that advocates equal rights for women. It no longer advocates equal rights for women but more tries to create a double standard and give them more of an "edge". Therefore it is devoid of its original point, therefore it is pointless. I don't really care one way or another about Feminism, I just found it an interesting topic. I thank Charlie_Danger for his argument in the first round and hope he can return to the rest of the debate. Sources: [1] - wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn [2] - http://www.merriam-webster.com... [3] - http://www.progressiveu.org...

  • CON

    I would like to finish the debate because I do not like...

    Feminism.

    Now seeing as you forfeited that round, I can conclude that you have either lost interest in the subject, or you have no other statements to disprove me. I would like to finish the debate because I do not like winning by default. This round will be conclusions so I will write mine now. Feminism has been around for a long time and is still going strong. When it first began, it was fighting for women's rights. The organization itself has nothing to do with males at all. So in conclusion, feminism does have a gender. It may have male supporters, but it promotes the female population. It does nothing for the male population except belittle them in the eyes of the public.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism./1/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.63
      feminism: 24.63
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 9.20 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.56)
      sourceText: 1.99 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.13)
  • CON

    At first it was a good cause and was for woman rights but...

    Feminism

    I believe that Feminism is coming out of hand. At first it was a good cause and was for woman rights but now they are taking it too far. I believe feminism is the equality of woman but I also believe we've already got to that point. I think what some feminists don't understand is that some woman like being a stay at home mom and by them still pursuing it it makes them feel inferior. I've also met some feminist who say that they think that woman are superior and I do not think that is anywhere near the truth. We need each other not only as partners but as a union our minds work differently and we need our other part for the world to be in harmony.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/4/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.45
      feminism: 24.45
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 9.20 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.56)
      sourceText: 1.81 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 1.94)
  • CON

    Rebuttal "Do you grow up as a kid thinking: I want to...

    Feminism

    Ironically enough, If you're searching for 'valid' arguments in favour of Feminism then academia would be the place to go. I did not recycle any of my arguments personally, Though you're welcome to do so if you cite the source. Have you tried Google Scholar? I also think you may be under a misconception so let's clear it up now. I am arguing against feminism, Not against feminists as individuals. Feminism is simply not egalitarian, I'd regard it primarily as insidious subversion. Rebuttal "Do you grow up as a kid thinking: I want to work at a sewage plant for half my life! You don't. " Many men choose to become plumbers, Construction works, Or go into a trade career because it's in high demand. I feel bad for the few people on the job who have to wade through faeces but that isn't a common occurrence and a result of their own failings. "But if an egalitarian agenda is fought for in the name of equality for women" By fighting for something in the name of specifically women you've ruled out the possibility of it ever being egalitarian. "The concept of the 'perfect girl' is still a thing focused upon by too many girls in my school, Middle aged mothers, And recently graduated college students. " The only reason this could be harmful is if the women/girls are alienated from this endeavour. It happens, But this isn't rectifiable by feminism. "Another recent event that has come in the name of equality is the 'me too' movement. Allegations should always be taken seriously, But if they are false, The victim has to own up to his or her lies" Could you explain the results of this movement in detail, It seems you may be excluding a few crucial details [4]. Under a feminist culture, There is no reason for a false-victim to own up to her lips as she's a victim of the patriarchy. "In an egalitarian movement, Everyone has the right to express whoever they want to be. This is not something I see in my school. There are about 50-150 girls in my school that if you put them side by side, You would have trouble telling the differences. " Is anyone forcing all 150 of these girls to behave and act in the exact same manner? It seems to me that isn't the case and that they're emulating a perceived ideal. Individuals are defined by their differences and groups by their similarity, We'd do well to remember this. "Was it right and just that women got to vote or no? " Sure it was, But it isn't a feminist concept. "Yes, We are different, But we are still equal. We are all intelligent to a degree and had the same ancestors. So, Women should be exactly equal to men. There is a difference between equality and equity. Equality is where everyone gets treated the same no matter what, Equity is where everyone gets exactly what they need to come out equal in the end. " Saying "women should be exactly equal to men" is an argument for equality of outcome. We are not equal in terms of biology or psychology, Which makes sense considering the psyche has a physiological grounding. [5][6] This is an unachievable ideal and pursuit of it always results in bloodshed. "This is both a micro-aggression and stereotyping. Do all feminists or even all contemporaries become angry at the concept of a person not being fooled by a lie? . . . You can't argue against both. You argue against the contemporary movement, Which is more women>men, But you fail to realize there are two more pieces of the shattered movement. . . . The original movement still stands. " It very clearly wasn't stereotyping, I specified postmodern feminism which is the primary denomination of modern feminism. If you don't understand the postmodernist movement you don't understand anything of modern politics. I don't understand this type of vocabulary. I've never heard of a "microaggression" before, But this seems a very convenient way to discount the character of an individual with opposing ideas. "Brave women who want to be soldiers, Who want to feel equally safe, Who want to compete, Who want to preform physical labor, Who want to live their life to the fullest in co-existence with everyone. " These women are not feminists, And those who are are in a smaller minority than the intellectuals of the feminist movement. Also, I am not arguing against the people I'm arguing against the idea. Lieing to these women is not doing them any good, It becomes even more heinous when you do so because they're women. There were many good Nazis, That doesn't make Nazism good. Even provided everything you've said is true, You're taking a marginal case and arguing it broadly. Also, It seems you've neglected to directly address at least 2 of the 5 points I articulated against Feminism. I will put my sources in my profile.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/34/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.25
      feminism: 24.25
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 8.82 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.50)
      sourceText: 1.99 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.12)
  • CON

    I agree right off the bat that gender egalitarianism is...

    Feminism is idiotic.

    I agree right off the bat that gender egalitarianism is an ideal which society should strive for. However, in places such as the Afghanistan where women are blatantly treated worse than men, feminism is necessary for the achievement of that end. Feminism serves to level the playing field in places where the playing field is unequal to begin with. So by valuing gender egalitarianism, Pro concedes the debate: feminism can't be idiotic if it is working towards a cause which Pro himself agrees with.

  • CON

    I assume that we are arguing whether feminism is a...

    Feminism

    I assume that we are arguing whether feminism is a positive or negative thing. Since my opponent is affirming, he/she has the burden of proof to show that it is a positive thing. I await my opponent's opening round.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Feminism/8/
    • score
      BM25 score: 24.13
      feminism: 24.13
      conclusion: 13.44 (boost 1.50, idf 5.97, tfNorm 1.50)
      premises: 8.73 (idf 5.90, tfNorm 1.48)
      sourceText: 1.97 (boost 0.20, idf 4.68, tfNorm 2.10)