• PRO

    They are both major problems plaguing the world, And must...

    Climate Change Exists

    Climate change and global warming both exist from a fundamental basis. They are both major problems plaguing the world, And must be solved. In order for humans to survive this era, These issues must be addressed and climate change deniers must realize that they do need to act. One shouldn't even have to argue for or against this topic. It has been proven by hundreds upon hundreds of scientists that greenhouse gases and carbon emissions from humans are negatively affecting the environment.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-Change-Exists/4/
  • CON

    Then the source basically states, science does not know,...

    Anthropogenic climate change.

    This is as close as the opponent comes to making an argument about cause: "A scientific consensus exists on the reality of anthropogenic climate change. ' But there is a scientific consensus on the reality of anthropogenic climate change. Climate scientists have repeatedly tried to make this clear. It is time for the rest of us to listen.'[0]" That is the only statement that is close to an argument about cause. Then the source basically states, science does not know, but what if. Then appeals to emotion by asking people to think about their grandchildren, thus action to reduce CO2 must be taken, you know just in case. The question could also be asked, what if the consensus is wrong? The alarmists are advocating for billions of people to reduce their living standards to keep the planet from maybe warming a few degrees. Looking at the analogy mostly used to explain green house effect, which is a green house. A few years ago I was in an empty plastic sheet green house on a sunny but very cold day. The very thin sheet of clear plastic raised the inside temperature significantly, but the owner was planning on disassembling within a few days. My question to the owner was "would a second sheet of plastic make the green house warmer for longer?" The owner looked at me and said "it does not work that way". There would be an insulation effect if there is a gap between the two sheets of plastic. Yet, this false consensus is asking us to believe that more CO2 equals higher global temperatures. From an idea that more plastic does not make a green house warmer to a question would more CO2 make the Earth warmer. There is research that suggests once there is enough CO2 to have a green house effect more will not cause higher temperatures[1]. This is outside the narrative and must be stopped. Government's need a reason for people to be scared so that controls can be forced on everyone. In summary, consensus is not science! Climate change has become like a religion for those that believe. Western civilization learned centuries ago that state and religion is best separated. Thus, policy changes based on climate change consensus should not be enacted by governments. 1. http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com...

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Anthropogenic-climate-change./1/
  • CON

    2010 and Carlton et al. ... Do you have any other...

    Climate change is a fraud

    I still can't tell if you are claiming that the climate is not changing at all or if you believe it is changing but for natural reasons rather than anthropogenic. Could you please clarify this in your next argument so I know what I am arguing against going forward? Now, To your arguments: 1. The 97% number may not be exactly on-the-nose, But it is around that. The study by Cook et al. (2013) which is commonly cited as the source of this number examined thousands of scientific studies on climate change and found that 97% of papers which declared a stance on the question of whether humans contribute to climate change took the side that we do. Later analysis by Cook and his colleagues of his study and others determined the consensus was probably between 90 and 100%, According to Forbes. Critics, Like the one in the video you referred to, Have attacked Cook for excluding studies which did not explicitly endorse anthropogenic climate change, Saying they should be counted as "uncertain" or rejecting the idea. However, Another study hilariously applied this logic to hundreds of recent geology papers and found that 0% explicitly endorsed the theory of plate tectonics, Which there is a scientific consensus on. That's because you don't have to declare that you support a theory, Like climate change, When it is no longer in doubt. Other studies besides Cook's which found similar results include Oreskes 2004, Doran and Zimmerman 2009, Anderegg et al. 2010 and Carlton et al. 2015. 2. The mass of humans vs. The mass of Earth does not mean we cannot effect the Earth. We humans have made enough nuclear weapons to kill every living organism on Earth depsite our mass being less than that of the world's termites. What matters, In this context, Is the physical properties of greenhouse gases. Gases like carbon dioxide, Methane and water vapor are penetrable to shortwave radiation (visible light from the sun) but not to longwave radiation (thermal energy; heat). This is not a property which can be faked, Or else it would easily be found out by independent investigation. So when sunlight converts to longwave radiation, The heat gets trapped by the greenhouse effect. 3. Atmospheric CO2 has no true saturation point; people who claim this based on data have usually misapplied a linear scale to CO2 concentration. The severity of CO2's greenhouse effect scales logarithmically, And if concentration is scaled by logarithm, A constant increase in the greenhouse effect is apparent, As in this graph: http://gallery. Myff. Org/gallery/171547/modtran-rad-bal. GIF 4. The corruption of a single public figure does not negate the science. Maurice Strong was an oil tycoon, Not a scientist. Anthropogenic climate change was actually discovered by environmental scientists working for Exxon in the 1970s and 80s, But just like now, The oil companies didn't want to give up their ticket to riches, So instead of switching their focus away from fossil fuels and toward renewables, They started a massive denialism campaign to convince people that climate change was not anthropogenic. The science, However, Says otherwise. Here is just a sampling of studies which support the notion of anthropogenic climate change: Karl and Trenberth 2003 Allen et al. 2006 Cayan et al. 2010 Barnett et al. 1999 Berliner, Levine and Shea 2000 (links removed because it was not letting me post with them in) 5. Tree rings are not the only proxy used to estimate historic and prehistoric climate trends--dating back even farther are the proxies of isotopic ratios in ice core samples and mineral/rock composition of particular strata--but when used, They are very effective. The trunk of a tree is actually made of secondary xylem, A type of vascular tissue which conducts water. Temperature and precipitation can both effect the width of the xylem tubes, Called tracheids, And how densely packed they are. A seasoned naturalist can identify these differences in samples bored from living trees. By observing patterns in xylem from recent years, When temperature and precipitation were measured precisely by human instruments, One can reach a point where one can correctly describe the known weather conditions from an area for a given year just by looking at a sample from a tree. So none of the things you listed so far have debunked anthropogenic climate change or climate change in general. Do you have any other arguments you would like to put forth?

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-change-is-a-fraud/1/
  • PRO

    First, the science is settled, this is a political debate...

    Anthropogenic global climate change.

    Round two arguments. First, the science is settled, this is a political debate that deniers try to make look like a scientific debate. Fact: There is a 97% consensus on First, the science is settled, this is a political debate that deniers try to make look like a scientific debate. Fact: There is a 97% consensus on climate change. Climate scientists are the experts of experts in their field. A consilience of evidence, social calibration, and social diversity exist. Myth: 31,000 scientists signed a petition so therefore there is no consensus. Fallacy: Fake experts, as the expertise increases so does agreement. Co2 is at the highest it has been in over 800,000 years. Tempatures are rising. Glaciers are overall losing mass. Humans fingerprints show humans are extremely likely to be causing these events. Burning of fossil fuels and the released Co2 is the main driver of climate change. Thank you.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Anthropogenic-global-climate-change./4/
  • PRO

    Climate Change is happening right now because we know...

    Climate Change is happening - NOW

    Climate Change is happening right now because we know that temperatures globally have risen by around 1degree since 1900. https://climate. Nasa. Gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-Change-is-happening-NOW/1/
  • PRO

    2] Danger: "The state of being vulnerable to injury or...

    Climate Change Is Not an Imminent Danger

    Due to many problems posting arguments for the last debate, Citrakayah and I have decided to restart the debate in order to iron out the structural problems of this debate and because the computer deleted my argument. I extend my opponent the best of luck. Full Resolution Climate change is not an imminent danger to the general wellbeing of this planet. I will be arguing for this resolution. BoP is shared. Definitions Climate Change: "...a long-term change in the statistical distribution of weather patterns over periods of time that range from decades to millions of years."[1] Imminent: "Liable to happen soon; impending ."[2] Danger: "The state of being vulnerable to injury or loss; risk."[3] Basically, the resolution is that climate change will not significantly damage the earth in the next century or two. Rules 1. The first round is for acceptance. 2. A forfeit or concession is not allowed. 3. No semantics, trolling, or lawyering. 4. All arguments must be visible inside this debate. Sources may be posted in an outside link. 5. Debate resolution, definitions, rules, and structure cannot be changed without asking in the comments before you post your round 1 argument. Debate resolution, definitions, rules, and structure cannot be changed in the middle of the debate. Voters, in the case of the breaking of any of these rules by either debater, all seven points in voting should be given to the other person.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-Change-Is-Not-an-Imminent-Danger/2/
  • CON

    Maurice Strong is the main person that started this whole...

    Climate Change is a real issue

    I propose that climate change is a fraud and that the people who support it are all frauds and charlatans. The science of human-caused climate change is faulty and full of misconceptions and bad science. 1. Video evidence - The In-depth Story Behind A Climate Fraud. The 97% consensus fraud. 2. It's mathematically impossible and against the laws of physics that a tiny human mass verses huge Earth mass, That the former can effect the latter. 3. The properties of CO2 are such that it can't create global warming on the scale indicated by scientists. This is because CO2 reaches it's saturation point at 80 parts / million and doesn't reflect any significant amount of heat after this point is reached. 4. Maurice Strong is the main person that started this whole climate frenzy movement and was found to be corrupt and fled to China to hide from the global police. 5. Climate data fraud. Tree rings used as evidence when it is known that tree ring growth is not an accurate measurement of temperature. "Hide the decline" email by Phil Jones. Mike's trick. Hockey stick nonsense. Inverted graphs. Etc. 6. Climate Change is the biggest hoax and sham made by Obama and his crew of liberal loving communist democrats. If you allow them to take money from our paychecks into a plan that doesn't a solution because the problem does not exist, You are giving the democrats power to the Chinese for a global communist take over. To submit to the new world order. Stand your ground. Text fraud 88022. Text vote to 88022. Joe Biden will carry out what Obama couldn't finish. Don't let him There, That should keep you busy for a while. Refute all these points. Good luck.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-Change-is-a-real-issue/2/
  • PRO

    He resigned because he considers that climate change...

    Climate change

    I will present my position, and then I will state the things upon me and Con agree, then I will react to the arguments brought up by Con. My position I have stated that humans "drive" global warming in a significant degree. Significant is the key word here. Nobody is so naive to consider that global climate is driven only or even mostly by humans. That would be an absurd position and a probatio diabolica for Pro taking into account things like solar activity, ocean currents or vulcanic activity. I have chosen the more sane position that human activity is an important or significant factor of global warming. By this I understand that what we do with regard to greenhouse gases has consequences on the climate and ultimately on us. Consensus I agree with Con that this is a broad topic. However even from the second round there are things upon we have already agreed effectively narrowing the topic. The first agreed fact is that the climate is warming. This is an smart choice from Con, as it would have been more difficult to argue that the climate is not warming. Also, Con admits that humans have a marginal effect. I say that this effect is important. We also agree that we are talking only about greenhouse gases even if this reduces the examples that Pro can bring up. In addition I want to point out the contradiction between the second paragraph and the last paragraph of Con. In the first paragraph he admits that there is global warming and in the last paragraph he talks about cO2 increase not explaining "stable" recent temperatures. I want a clarification on this position as I can not counterargument both these statements without contradicting myself. I now ask Con if we can agree upon a criterion or standard that can determine what important means for this debate? A good criterion could be the answer to the question: IS IT IMPORTANT ENOUGH TO DO SOMETHING (green energy, trade caps etc.) ABOUT IT? This standard/criterion can be refined but I think it is a good start. Disensus Con states that IPCC is biased, incompetent or has a secret agenda determined by bureaucrats. In the evidence presented [1] a scientist resigned from IPCC because he feared that IPCC MAY depart from scientific objectivity. He resigned because he considers that climate change science must remain politically neutral. Furthermore no one "imposed" any ideas on the scientist. I demand proof that there are imposed views on such a huge number of scientists. On the other hand it would be foolish for us to think that the discoveries of climate scientists have no political meaning. Besides the science there is an also a political battle. For the sake of our debate the two must be understood separately. Bearing this in mind I must point out that Con has pointed no secret agenda or motives for the IPCC to be biased. On the other hand I can point out a clear secret agenda (from the political perspective. There are people (like Con) that deny GW for the sake of finding the truth). One example is the editing of climate change reports by the White House [2]. The other two are the founding of The Marshal Institute by Exxon Mobile (the books quoted by Con are edited by the Marshal Institute) [3] and the relentless effort by the industry to promote climate change denial [4]. Their effort is nevertheless futile: first they argued that there is no GW, then that humans have no influence, than that the influence is insignificant etc. When comparing the "secret agenda" of IPCC and the quite obvious agenda of companies like Exxon it is clear who has more interest to mix politics and science and to misinform. Regarding the science arguments presented by Con, I will first point out that Con did not talk about anything about the super greenhouse effect on Venus that I have previously mentioned. This example shows that greenhouse gasses can produce quite dramatic effects. So from this perspective I consider that things are clear. With regards to many of the other arguments of Con, I must point out that his strategy is flawed. He will never win by pointing out a huge number of other causes that drive the climate even if they are more powerful than Co2. I clearly stated that I will prove that Co2 has a significant effect on GW. To make things more clear (bearing in mind the simplifications), let's consider t= f (sun, volcanoes, cosmic rays, clouds, particles, Co2 etc.) + e. Con can win if he shows that: the system is not sensible to Co2 variations; Co2 variations cause a smaller temperature increase than the noise (e); Co2 receives a negative feed-back that counters its effect. By analogy, if there is a heart stroke risk of x because of eating to much fat you can't prove that this risk is smaller by showing that drinking also has a y hart stroke risk. Furthermore, in the first round I pointed out a positive feedback of Co2. Con dismissed this feedback saying that temperatures increased in the past and there was "something" that stopped this vicious circle. This is wrong because, as I showed in my proof, these are the highest levels of Co2 reached in 650 000 years [5]. Also, when there was warmer weather in the past there also was more vegetation to absorb the Co2. Now we have more Co2, warmer weather and less vegetation so the Co2 is not absorbed by anything at the rate by which it is produced. There is proof of this happening in the Carboniferous Era 300 million years ago [6]. Unfortunately we do not have giant forests to gather the solar heat and the Co2. The proof that shows that nowadays the Co2 levels are at a record level also dismisses the "all this happened before and it will happen again" argument made by Con. Con alleges that Co2 variations must have a multiplier. This is not true. It is enough for Co2 to create a 0.5 C increase for every 40% to have significant effects. Furthermore Con states that if climate would be a car than the Co2 would be an acceleration pedal. To be more exact we should consider climate a car with multiple pedals (sun, volcanoes, etc.). Some pedals accelerate the car faster (sun), others accelerate the car slower (Co2). The fact that climate changed in less than 800 years simply shows that another more violent factor was involved not that Co2 theory is wrong. Further more the lag between temperature increase and Co2 has no significance. There will be a day of reckoning since Co2 is produced at a higher rate than it is absorbed in an ever increasing temperature that prevents Co2 absorption by oceans. Furthermore, the proof presented by Con itself acknowledges that there is some (although small) correlation between Co2 and temperature. From the fact that I reestablished the credibility of the IPCC reports, I have pointed out the clear bias of the two books presented by Con, I have pointed out the contradictions between the beginning and the end of his answer, I have showed that on Venus the greenhouse effect is really powerful, I have proven that Co2 rise is steady and has no negative feed-back, I conclude that my first position stands and that GW is man-made in a significant degree. Looking forward for another good round. [1] http://sciencepolicy.colorado.edu... [2] http://www.nytimes.com... [3] http://www.ucsusa.org... - P. 32 [4] http://www.newsweek.com... [5] http://www.geocraft.com...

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-change/1/
  • PRO

    Climate change is real.

    Climate change is real.

    Climate change is real.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-change-is-real./1/
  • CON

    If you answered the latter, you're among a quarter of...

    Jail climate change deniers.

    The problem with your argument is humans have been wrong with a lot of ideas. I find most of your argument fits under the ad populum fallacy. [2] Just because the majority of scientists think man made climate change is real and a threat, does not mean the scientists are correct. At one time we thought the Earth was flat and the sun revolved around the Earth. " "Does the Earth go around the Sun, or does the Sun go around the Earth?" If you answered the latter, you're among a quarter of Americans who also got it wrong, according to a new report by the National Science Foundation. " [3] There is a chance that the entire global warming/climate change is a scam. That the deniers are whistle blowers. If we start jailing whistle blowers we could be in a lot of trouble. [4] Remember that 97% of climate change scientists agree. That means 3% don't, those 3% could be legitimate whistle blowers. Some of the scientist claim there is bullying going on to reach the consensuses. [5] There is talk of data manipulation. [6] Honestly, I will not stoop by backing up the deniers. I think the chances of the deniers being wrong is at least 99%. Nevertheless, there is that 1% chance. More importantly, it sets a precedence as seen in r1. Finally, and perhaps my strongest argument. Assume for a second that the deniers are wrong. Not much of an assumption. Jailing the deniers could backfire. Causing them to become martyrs per say. Holding back political change and giving the deniers a louder voice.Thanks for debating and being respectful. I am not a climate change denier, I just feel both sides of the debate need to be represented. Sources 2. http://www.skepdic.com... 3. http://abcnews.go.com... 4. https://www.gov.uk... 5. 6. http://www.forbes.com...

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Jail-climate-change-deniers./1/