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On balance modern Feminism is beneficial to the modern United States.

For those who comment I ask that you be respectful to both sides of this debate. This topic can be heated. Mister_man is someone I have seen around the website and respect as a well-reasoned individual. I like to think of my-self in the same way. There is no need for ad hominem attacks in the comments, as I imagine them not to be present in the debate either. For this debate I intend to show convincingly the benefit that Feminism can and is providing to the U.S. today. My outline is very simple. I will… 1: Establish proof that men and women do not currently have equal rights and opportunities. 2: Present how Feminism can help and produce positive results in relation to this problem. In so doing I will affirm the resolution that “on balance modern Feminism is beneficial to the modern United States.” 1: Establish proof that men and women do not currently have equal rights and opportunities. A: Economic Injustice: This issue is also referred to as the pay gap. “In 2012, the median earnings of American women working full time year-round were $37,791. American men earned a median income of $49,398. The gender wage gap has hovered at about 77 cents on the dollar since 2007.” (1) This shows that generally men are paid more than women in the U.S. The typical response to this is to ask are women paid less because they choose lower-paying jobs? The answer is no as the following shows. “Earnings are high for both women and men who work as computer and information systems managers. But while median earnings for men in 2011 were just over $98,000, median earnings for women were around $86,000. Likewise, aerospace engineers tend to earn a good living. But while a typical male aerospace engineer took home just over $100,000 in 2011, his female counterpart was paid $83,000.”(2) This shows that Higher income occupations pay men more than women on average for the same work. “Median earnings for male engineering technicians in 2011 were just over $56,000 compared with median earnings of $43,000 for female engineering technicians. Among drafters, typical earnings for men were just over $51,000 while typical earnings for women were just over $45,000.” (2) This shows that median income occupations pay men more than women on average for the same work. Let us Move on to how poverty affects men and women. “one in three Americans lives at or below the poverty line, and almost 70% are women and children.” Or that “Women represent nearly two-thirds of minimum wage workers, concentrated in jobs that tend to be labor-intensive. They go without paid sick days or access to affordable child care. Moreover, women across the spectrum continue to earn less than men no matter the education level, profession or position” (3) “Add to this picture that 40% of our nation's households with children rely on women as a primary or sole source of income,”(3) Clearly the pay gap is empirically evident and as such is indisputable. Just as evident is that poverty affects women significantly more so than men. It can then be concluded that men and women do not have an equal rights or opportunity in the U.S. economy. B: Domestic violence: I recognize that this is not solely a women’s issue. However, as I will show, it is empirically evident that women are, on balance, affected significantly more than men. “Nearly one in five women surveyed said they had been raped or had experienced an attempted rape at some point, and one in four reported having been beaten by an intimate partner. One in six women have been stalked, according to the report.” (4) compare that to men, “One in seven men have experienced severe violence at the hands of an intimate partner, the survey found, and one in 71 men — between 1 percent and 2 percent — have been raped, many when they were younger than 11.” (4) Clearly domestic violence targets women significantly more than men. As this is a sad reality that 1 in 4 women deal with in our nation, it limits the opportunity and rights of women in a way not as true for men. 2: Present how Feminism can help and produce positive results in relation to this problem. Despite only 1/5 of Americans define themselves as feminists, (5) the Feminist movement has, and will continue to help bring equality to the USA. Historically, feminism helped bring the right to vote to women. The 60’s saw the Women’s rights movement, which brought up issues as equal rights and pay. It is true the U.S. has come a long way, but as is evident by the still present inequality, there is more to do. Feminism continues to bring these issues to light. Feminism continues to expose inequality. Feminism continues to lobby for justice. Feminism continues to be a positive force in the United States. The following link provides “23 Ways Feminism Has Made the World a Better Place for Men” (6) No I do not intend this to be a comprehensive addition to my argument as it would be beyond my character limit, nor should any expect my opponent to have to refute any of the 23 ways listed herein. I wanted to include this for those reading who would like a broader look at the impact of feminism today. As well as show the vastness of material that exists to show the positive impact feminism has today. Conclusion: Men and women do not currently have equal rights and opportunities. This is empirically evident by the stats that I have provided. Women are not paid equally, or afforded the same opportunity in the U.S. economy. Women are affected significantly more than men by domestic violence, as this has become a common issue (1 in 4) it limits the opportunity and rights of women in a way that does not generally affect men. Feminism has been, and will continue to be a force for good in the U.S. as it brings to light these injustices and lobbies for change. Therefore we are lead to conclude that “on balance modern Feminism is beneficial to the modern United States.” (1) http://www.huffingtonpost.com... (2) http://www.aauw.org... (3) http://www.cnn.com... (4) http://www.nytimes.com...; (5) http://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com... (6) http://mic.com...

3rd wave feminism has made notable progress for civil rights

Before I begin my rebuttal, I would like to thank Con for engaging in this debate, and offering a rebuttal to my assertions. First, Con neglected to acknowledge where I stressed the significance of the contributions toward Third Wave Feminism which were championed by less accepted, earlier feminist thinkers who were divergent from 2nd wave feminism. Such as sex positive Feminism, which was not accepted as mainstream until the Third Wave arose. "Sex Positive Feminism (http://en.wikipedia.org......) began in the 1980s and the Free-Love movement is from the 1960's however Third wave is presented as a 90's movement," Con makes this statement as if the three movements are mutually exclusive. The fact remains that sex-positive feminism was not an accepted widely until Third Wave feminism arose. Con's own source highlights this reality. " Some became involved in the sex-positive feminist movement in response to efforts by anti-pornography feminists, such as Catharine MacKinnon, Andrea Dworkin, Robin Morgan and Dorchen Leidholdt," (each of the examples given are 2nd wave feminists) (1) Further, it was not until the 90's that these movements gained the momentum needed to continue the progressive discourse. This time is often referred to as the "Feminist Sex Wars", and it is the crucible from which the third wave was born. Also considered part of the third wave is sex-positivity, a celebration of sexuality as a positive aspect of life, with broader definitions of what sex means and what oppression and empowerment may imply in the context of sex. For example, many third-wave feminists have reconsidered the opposition to pornography and sex work of the second wave, and challenge existing beliefs that participants in pornography and sex work are always being exploited. (2) To say sex positivity hasn't seen notable progress in the last 20 years is to ignore observable, documented facts to the contrary. "Rebecca Walker coined the term "third-wave feminism" in a 1992 essay." In order to label a group of movements which were influential, yet separate from the second wave movement. Con also assumes that the movement only began upon the creation of the "term" rather than the term having been created to help define a series of similar movements. "The roots of the third wave began, however, in the mid-1980s. Feminist leaders rooted in the second wave called for a new subjectivity in feminist voice. They sought to negotiate prominent space within feminist thought for consideration of race-related subjectivities." (3) In the essay, Walker, a black woman, explained how second wave feminism continued the marginalization of non heterosexual women and black women. "For many second-wave feminists, non-heterosexual women were seen as an embarrassment to the movement. The great feminist activist Betty Friedan, for example, coined the term "lavender menace" in 1969 to refer to what she considered the harmful perception that feminists are lesbians. She later apologized for the remark, but it accurately reflected the insecurities of a movement that was still very heteronormative in many ways." (4) As the above quote and source illustrate, issues facing women of color and transsexual, transgender and non-binary orientations, were not well represented until the third wave arose in the early 90's. Con claims - "The sex positive aspect of third wave feminism has resulted in the mellinial generation becoming the most accepting of other sexual orientations and genders." is unsupported... Because "other major occurrences and movements that happened prior to the birth of 3rd wave feminism." Con ignores the reality that these movements were not accepted or practiced until the rise of third wave feminism. Con's own arguments against the Third Wave's influence have been used against the emergence of the second wave, over a century ago. "The "new" feminism that emerged among the citified, educated daughters of the 1910s embraced the modernist impulse to leave the past behind. "Women, if you want to realize yourselves," Mina Loy wrote in her 1914 Feminist Manifesto, "the lies of centuries have got to be discarded. . . . Nothing short of Absolute Demolition will bring about reform." (5) This rather detailed essay explores how second wave feminism formed, despite the resistance of those who supported the status quo. "The new consumer culture substituted sexual liberation for political power, promoted shopping "choices" over real-life options, and promised young women the "freedom" to display their bodies, smoke and drink with the boys, and adopt the male perspective. As the New York Times noted approvingly in 1922, the modern girl "take[s] a man"s view as her mother never could." (5) By this analysis, the emergence of second wave feminism was marred by the consumerism and the adoption of "male" traits by flappers, in order to become "equal". Third wave feminism rejects the "male and female" roles, and instead allows each individual to choose their own gender role. I include this essay to show how 1st wave feminism evolved into second wave, with significant growing pains, just as second wave later evolved into third wave during the late 80's, thought it was not defined and labeled until the early 90's. Con claims Third Wave feminist beliefs predate the existence of Third wave feminism, which is entirely true, however Con is incorrect when they assume those movements did not evolve into Third Wave Feminism. America was a Capitalist nation long before Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels coined the term in the late 1860s. By Con's logic, America wasn't a capitalist nation until the early 1900s. It is far more often that social movements "begin" before they are "defined". This is the only argument Con has provided on any issue, including the below: "Transgenderism (http://en.wikipedia.org......) has been active for years long prior to the inception of 3rd Wave Feminism" 1. Con again argues that because the term "third wave" came after these movements began in theory, that these movements are not part of the third wave. 2. Con provides no sources, aside from a wiki definition of transgenderism, to support these claims. Con ignores the reality that the transgender feminism movement was rejected by the second wave, and was only accepted and widely discussed when the third wave arose. "Though second-wave feminism argued for the sex and gender distinction, some feminists believed there was a conflict between transgender identity and the feminist cause; e.g., they believed that male-to-female transition abandoned or devalued female identity, and that trangender people embraced traditional gender roles and stereotypes. Many transgender feminists, however, viewed themselves as contributing to feminism by questioning and subverting gender norms. Third wave and contemporary feminism more greatly accepts transgender people." (6) There have been conflicts with second wave feminist organizations which do not accept transgender individuals or the movement. "Perhaps the most visible site of conflict between feminists and trans women has been the Michigan Womyn's Music Festival. The festival ejected a transsexual woman, Nancy Burkholder, in the early 1990s.The activist group Camp Trans formed to protest the "womyn-born-womyn" policy and to advocate for greater acceptance of trans women within the feminist community" (7) To pretend second wave feminism accepted these ideas is contrary to the facts. Third wave, however, embraced them and brought them to the forefront of public discourse. For the small list of achievements: 1. "This is a 2nd wave battle and this is a continuation of that molding instead of a "victory"." Con chooses not to include the date of the newer legislation, which was finished in the early 90's, Con ignored the fact that third wave feminism was instrumental in getting it passed. Con offers no sources to refute this fact, aside from statistics indicating the effort worked. 2. "It is not a product of 3rd wave thinking" It directly bans gender-role stereotyping in the classroom, which is a third wave thought. Con also admits the example "Gender Equality Duty of 2007" fits the BOP. Con offers mostlywiki sources. SOURCES: 1. http://en.wikipedia.org... 2. Johnson, Merri Lisa, ed. (2002). Jane Sexes It Up: True Confessions of Feminist Desire. New York: Four Walls Eight Windows. 3. Hayes Taylor, Kimberly (March 8, 1995). "Feminism reaches the next generation " Walker underscores need for inclusion, change in 'third wave' 4. http://civilliberty.about.com... 5. http://susanfaludi.com... 6. Hines, Sally. TransForming gender: transgender practices of identity, intimacy and care. The Policy Press, 2007. 7. Hand, Michael and Sreedhar, Susanne (2006). "The Ethics of Exclusion: Gender and Politics at the Michigan Womyn's Music Festi

Feminism is bad for society

Sorry. I had personal issues i needed to take care of, and thus could not get to the internet. Here is my first (and only argument.) Again, sincere apologies. Modern I had personal issues i needed to take care of, and thus could not get to the internet. Here is my first (and only argument.) Again, sincere apologies. Modern feminism is harmful for many reasons. The first hint at this is the prefix "Fem", or about women. Not about men, because feminism doesn't care about inequality towards men. (Child support, divorce issues, lack of attention to male issues, gender stereotypes (Be a man, don't cry, etc.) Now, I would like to address the issue of the "wage gap". The wage gap of 77% was a statistic measured many years ago. This is just assuming this statistic is true, which it probably isn't anyways, because when you factor in the fact that women take jobs that pay less anyways, this issue goes away. (It has been proven that women take jobs involving social sciences more, which pay less than hard science jobs that men are more interested in.) Next I would like to address the issue of domestic violence. Is domestic violence against women a problem? Yes. Of course it is. However, statistics have pointed out that close to 40% of domestic violence victims are men. Little to no attention has been given to this issue, because of feminist double standards. Finally, I would like to address body image. Are women pressured to stay thin? As with domestic violence, yes. They are. But, again, so are men. Men are also subject to the "body norms" of society. This is an undeniable fact. (Not saying this is a good thing, standards for beauty need to be eliminated for both sexes, and the fact that they are still in place proves what a shallow society we are.) If you took the time to read this, thank you. I don't expect you to respond, but very much welcome one.

Modern Feminism Is Pointless

Okay, it is now Round 4 and let me sum up your argument in this debate. The whole time you have MOSTLY given only pro-feminist opinions as the thesis for your argument. EVERYONE has an opinion so it is therefore useless in a debate like this. MY thesis has been based off past current events, historical events, and personal experiences to show that the Feminist Movement is not only pointless but it is also hurting people. It is painting a bad image on both men and women that is doing a lot of damage and is contributing to the division of society. The very idea of feminism is now becoming an excuse to get away with outrageous things. Jodi Arias tried to play the I'm just an innocent woman who was defending herself role and it was proven she was lying and that she stalked that man and murdered him in cold blood. She actually had the nerve to say that this man tried to rape her. Now that she is guilty she is trying to avoid the death penalty by trying to convince everyone she is crazy when she is completely sane according to experts. You are defending a so-called "movement" that you claim fights against injustice, but they are actually creating injustice. Like I said a lot of men are losing property and things they love because the feminist movement is putting the idea into people's minds that they are the victims. You say that this is an image just projected in people's minds, but the fact that you go along with looking like a victim all the time only strengthens that image. The Feminist Movement has proven that they have a strict agenda of getting more things that could benefit them and throwing out things that could harm them physically. Stop giving me pointless opinions that I have literally heard from EVERY pro-feminist and give me actual facts and events that suggest that The very idea of feminism is now becoming an excuse to get away with outrageous things. Jodi Arias tried to play the I'm just an innocent woman who was defending herself role and it was proven she was lying and that she stalked that man and murdered him in cold blood. She actually had the nerve to say that this man tried to rape her. Now that she is guilty she is trying to avoid the death penalty by trying to convince everyone she is crazy when she is completely sane according to experts. You are defending a so-called "movement" that you claim fights against injustice, but they are actually creating injustice. Like I said a lot of men are losing property and things they love because the feminist movement is putting the idea into people's minds that they are the victims. You say that this is an image just projected in people's minds, but the fact that you go along with looking like a victim all the time only strengthens that image. The Feminist Movement has proven that they have a strict agenda of getting more things that could benefit them and throwing out things that could harm them physically. Stop giving me pointless opinions that I have literally heard from EVERY pro-feminist and give me actual facts and events that suggest that feminism has been good for our society in the last 20 years.

Modern feminism is cancer.

For the sake of separation of rounds I request that you refrain from addressing any of my arguments in this round (2). This round is solely for building up your arguments. Before I begin, I'd like to define what I mean by modern feminism. Modern feminism refers to the third and fourth wave feminist movements. I'm not trash talking the first feminists who actually strove to achieve equal constitutional rights for men and women, but now it has turned into something else. Every feminist you see on the news or media these days seem hell-bent on "destroying the patriarchy". They blame all the problems they have on men. They say the wage gap that exists is because men are discriminating against women, when they completely ignore that the entire wage gap is the result of individual women's choices. They say women are discouraged from going into STEM fields, when females are even more encouraged than men to pursue these careers. The modern feminist movements try to portray women as victims of society that need special treatment over men. These feminists advocate "equality of the sexes" but when mens' issues are brought up, they disregard them. Also, men and women aren't the same. Feminists sometimes say, "Why are men so afraid to show their feelings?" or "Why do men try so hard to be masculine?" (Try the Buzzfeed video "26 questions women have for men") These feminists try to make men less masculine for the sake of "gender equality" but then go after the masculine guys (because that's how nature works). Obviously this round was a little rushed (sorry for the late response), but I'll have a lot more to say in the upcoming rounds.

Resolved: Modern American Feminism is Both Correct and Needed

Modern American feminism (3rd/quasi-4th wave fem.) is correct: Women in the West continue to, by-and-large, be treated like second class citizens. Women make up more than half of the American population. They earn 60% of undergraduate degrees, and 60% of Masters degrees, 47% of law degrees, 48% of medical degrees, and 59% of the college-educated, entry-level workforce. Despite all this, they comprise less than 15% of executive offices, 8.1% of top-earners, 20% of women in congress. Despite making up more than 45% of associates in the legal field, only 15% of equity partners are women. This is to say nothing of the even more substantial gap present in the lives of coloured women in the United States, which is itself a major focus of contemporary, intersectional feminism. (1) Women also continue to lack agency over bodies - aside from momentous beauty standards (and the enduring sentiment that a woman's beauty is her only true asset), there is the ongoing war against the female libido (slut-shaming, attire standardization, etc.), and the persisting anti-abortion movement. These issues alone should illustrate the sustained relevance of feminism in America. (1) https://www.americanprogress.org...