PRO

  • PRO

    The force of proposition’s case is that it is a ‘defense’...

    Forcing change in liberal democracies is itself illiberal

    The force of proposition’s case is that it is a ‘defense’ of liberalism – allowing all people, no matter who they are, to access rights and freedoms. We clash with this directly, and contend that forcing legislative changes (that bring about marginal benefits to small numbers of society) on a country that is clearly averse to such changes is itself illiberal. And it is precisely those countries in which this debate falls – we are not contesting whether states that already have functioning systems for same-sex marriage should abandon those systems, but whether, in opposition’s words ” bob loblaw”. Liberalism is in essence the preference for self determination at the most personal level. But a state (and the body of laws encapsulated by that state) is merely an abstraction of personal preferences and wills, and hence, in a classical Rousseauian sense (the same beliefs on which US federalism is predicated), a liberal state’s norms, practises, and legislation, must be defined from the bottom up rather than the top down. It is only through determining the rules that bind one at the level of the state that one can truly practise liberal self determination. If we accept proposition’s proposal and force same-sex marriage upon (effectively) all societies, we are in fact incurring a great cost to the very liberal project we are intending to promote and protect, for an as yet unclear benefit. Remember, this is not, as proposition believes, the profound disenfranchising of homosexuals by removing their rights to access economic opportunities or public services and utilities. The reality is that, at present, the majority of people in the ‘contested’ countries of this debate do in fact feel that same-sex marriage should not be allowed (that’s why these countries are the interesting cases). Gallup polls as recent as 2009 show this to be true, and show that in those states which have forced through same-sex marriage legislation against the will of their population have not seen a rapid decrease in resistance to same-sex marriage [[http://www.gallup.com/poll/118378/majority-americans-contine-oppose-gay-marriage.aspx]]. We advocate precisely the attitude of California’s Supreme Court who refused to overturn a public referendum (Prop 8) on homosexual marriages that came down in the negative; it is not the place of legislators or judges to impose, illiberally, legislation on the collective.

    • https://debatewise.org/1047-same-sex-marriage-should-be-legal/
  • PRO

    BERNIE BEATS TRUMP IN 47 OUT OF 50 polls, So he is...

    its Bernie or bust, We are suck of moderates, WE WANT REAL CHANGE

    BERNIE BEATS TRUMP IN 47 OUT OF 50 polls, So he is electable, He could have won in 2016

  • PRO

    in 206 i was convinced to vote for a moderate clinton,...

    its Bernie or bust, We are suck of moderates, WE WANT REAL CHANGE

    in 206 i was convinced to vote for a moderate clinton, How did thta work out> why not go for the candidate i really supoort? I'm sick of the lesser evil sick sick sick

  • PRO

    WHether he can win of not is in doubt, BUT HE MAY WELL...

    its Bernie or bust, We are suck of moderates, WE WANT REAL CHANGE

    WHether he can win of not is in doubt, BUT HE MAY WELL WIN, He might not get everything from moderates but he will be there to guide the ship in the right direction

  • PRO

    The scientists have found they could only produce small...

    Evidence that mutation is the cause of change in evolution has not been proven

    First, let me thank my worthy opponent for accepting the debate. Let me begin by saying I will not be able to stipulate that evolution is true since the underlying premise of the debate is that I do not believe that the evidence supports the theory. I directed the debate toward two things it has not conclusively shown-evidence and analysis. According to the theory,beneficial mutations acted upon natural selection to create new creatures such as the bat from the squirrel. Most mutations are harmful but supposedly a good mutation slips into the gene pool and these new mutations created new animals. If this is true and we could speed up the evolutinary process, we should be able to show it in the lab. Enter the fruit fly. It is perfect for studybecause it goes from egg to adult in about 10 days. Since the early 1900's, multiplied millions of fruit fly generations have been bred and studied in labs for different mutations. So far wide have been the studies, that it is the equivalent of millions of years of supposed evolutionary time. The scientists have found they could only produce small changes and then sterility sets in because mutaions are harmful and have limits. What do see after all the experiments done on them?? We still see fruit flies! That is all the best minds of research see. One researcher named Richard Goldschmidt reacted this way, "After observing fruit flies for many years, he fell into despair-the changes he said"were so hopelessly micro that if a thousand mutations were combined into one specimen, there would still be no new species"(1) My next point is analyzing the fossil records. Fossil records should on the whole support the claim that today's complex organisms evolved step by tiny step based on mutations and natural selection. It is generally conceded that the fossil evidence is stable over long periods of time. This is called "stasis" in the field of evolution. Then new forms appear already developed without the eviedence of preceding transitional forms. Even Darwin himself knew the record did not support his theory and the record has actually become worse since his day. In fact it was not religous people who opposed it at first but palentologis since they knew the fossil record did not support it. They analyised it and found it wanting. The extreme rarity of transitional forms has been dexcribed as the "great trade secret of palentology")2)In addition, extinctions are typically due to catastrophies such as comets not imaginary evolutionary forces that kill out weaker species and bring forth their stronger more able cousins. This "flies" in the face of evolutionay theories. Evolution has many holes in it and the evidence is lacking in how species develop. If it is a science, it should stand up to testing, which I think it has not. I turn the time over to my opponent. 1. Darwin Retired by Norman Macbeth 1971 p.33 2.Darwin on trial pp59-60 wikipeadia-fruit flies www.talkorigons.org

  • PRO

    Implementation and focus of ideas depends on the...

    In Parliamentary Democracies, A Change Of Prime Minister Should Automatically Trigger A General Election.

    Implementation and focus of ideas depends on the personality of the Prime Minister rather than the party

  • PRO

    Legitimacy of the government

    In Parliamentary Democracies, A Change Of Prime Minister Should Automatically Trigger A General Election.

    Legitimacy of the government

  • PRO

    Legitimacy

    In Parliamentary Democracies, A Change Of Prime Minister Should Automatically Trigger A General Election.

    Legitimacy

  • PRO

    Definitions:

    In Parliamentary Democracies, A Change Of Prime Minister Should Automatically Trigger A General Election.

    Definitions:

  • PRO

    Framework of the debate

    In Parliamentary Democracies, A Change Of Prime Minister Should Automatically Trigger A General Election.

    Framework of the debate

CON