PRO

  • PRO

    If a scientist takes no stance, they neither support nor...

    Climate Shift

    A suprisingly short response. Framework My opponent has totally ignored the framework thus far, using round 1 for construction instead of acceptance, and round 2 for rebuttals instead of construction. Conduct should be awarded to pro for this reason. Pro's Defence Only the scientists who report opinions have opinions that matter. This is called Voluntary Response Bias. If a scientist takes no stance, they neither support nor deny the existence of climate shift. This point my opponent makes does not meet the burden of proof, and does not fully discredit the scientific consensus. The source my opponent posted does not even fully discredit my argument. Many of my points are left totally unrebbutted, and I forward those points. "The true debate is about the cause of climate change, as we already know it has changed many times before now." This statement is vague and unsourced and isn't a compelling argument. My opponent seeks to rebut my entire argument by a failed discrediting of one source and point. He does not present a compelling case, and his argument does not meet the burden of proof.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-Shift/2/
  • PRO

    While the entire world needs to reduce their carbon...

    The American government should take an active role in stopping climate change

    Of all contemporary political issues, there is one clear issue that stands out from all of the rest. It stands out because, unlike all other issues, it affects every single person in the world, and every single person who ever will live on this planet. Climate change is a huge problem which could potentially kill us if we don't do something to stop it [1]. Scientists are certain that climate change, at least very significantly, caused by humans [2]. As I always say when I debate religion, you can believe whatever you want, but it's ridiculous to say that the scientific consensus is wrong when you have little to no evidence. Now, since we know that global warming is caused by humans, we will clearly need to change as a society. If you look at the graph of countries in source [3], you will see that the US and China are really close in terms of emissions, but are clearly ahead of other countries. However, China has 4.3 times as many people as the US. So, the average American will emit about 4 times as much carbon as the average Chinese person. That is disgusting. While the entire world needs to reduce their carbon emissions, the US needs to change the most. Unfortunately, it is rather difficult to get 3 million people to change the way they live their lives. That is why the government needs to do something. Now, even though the debate is whether or not the government should do something, it wouldn't do the debate any justice to neglect to talk about what the government could do. First of all, the government could instill a major tax on paper and plastic shopping bags. Paper bags kill countless trees and require huge amounts of energy to produce. Plastic bags obviously are made from oil and they don't biodegrade, so they get in our waterways and do bad things, as you've no doubt seen. Both paper and plastic bags are bad [4]. There is already a movement among environmentally conscious people in which they shop using reusable canvas bags. Those are much more sustainable for the environment, and if paper and plastic bags weren't free anymore, people would be much more inclined to bring their own, or at the very least reuse their old bags. Also, the government could tax big businesses which do not take initiative in protecting the environment. This is a straightforward and easy way to force businesses to care. Lastly (or at least the last one I will mention in this argument), the government could do simple things, such as not allowing offshore drilling. Yes, offshore drilling will reduce our dependence on foreign oil. But our dependence on foreign oil would also be reduced if we simply educed our dependence on oil. It is absolutely ridiculous how much oil we use in the US. We are only home to about 4.5% of the world's population, yet we consume almost a quarter of the oil [5]. That is absolutely ridiculous. We may slam China for being inconsiderate of the environment, so much so that we forget that we are as bad as they are, or way worse per capita. The US is absolutely horrible in terms of environmental protection, and 3 million people won't change spontaneously, at least, not before it's too late. That is why we need the government to get involved now. We don't want it to be too late. I am looking forward to your response! 1. No, I am not just playing in to media hype. Here is an excellent website spelling out exactly how it will kill us, brought to you by our very own EPA: http://www.epa.gov... 2. http://www.epa.gov... "Scientists know with virtual certainty that:..." 3. http://www.epa.gov... 4. http://www.reusablebags.com... 5. http://www.nationmaster.com...

  • PRO

    The earth's climate has always shifted dramatically...

    Irreversible climate change makes geoengineering unavoidable.

    It is impossible for humans to avoid geoengineering in the future. The earth's climate has always shifted dramatically throughout its history. The Earth will, for instance, enter another ice age fairly soon. Should we, then, just allow this to happen? No, particularly if it means sacrificing millions of human lives and civilization as we know it. We should make the world work for us, not allow it to obliterate us. And, if we assume geoengineering is enevitable, then there is no moral boundary to doing it now, when global warming poses the threat that does to human civilization.

    • http://www.debatepedia.org/en/index.php/Debate:_Geoengineering%2C_solar_shading
  • PRO

    Developed countries have the greatest capacity to combat...

    developed countries have a higher obligation to combat climate change than developing countries

    Developed countries have the greatest capacity to combat climate change.

  • PRO

    Developed countries must combat climate change while...

    developed countries have a higher obligation to combat climate change than developing countries

    Developed countries must combat climate change while developing countries have more pressing concerns

  • PRO

    Brown, a former Massachusetts senator, is seeking to...

    Scott Brown, Cory Gardner Shift Stance On Climate Change In First Senate Debates

    Republican Senate candidates Scott Brown and Cory Gardner on Monday embraced the notion that climate change is caused in part by human activity, despite previously expressing skepticism that man-made climate change is real. Brown, a former Massachusetts senator, is seeking to unseat Sen. Jeanne Shaheen in New Hampshire, while Gardner, a congressman from Colorado, is looking to defeat Sen. Mark Udall in that state. Both Senate races, regarded as unexpectedly competitive for Democrats, had debates on Monday -- the first for New Hampshire candidates, the second for Colorado. In both,...

    • https://www.allsides.com/story/will-gop-take-over-senate
  • PRO

    So if you have the links to those that would be great to...

    Climate Change is a real issue

    I debated against you about a month ago. So far you failed to provide such proof other than claiming it. You have no link to back your proof up. So if you have the links to those that would be great to see and help you state your claim and me to come up with better counterarguments. The average temperature has continued to rise by a degree ever since factory jobs became popular in the industrial revolution. During these times, We used fossil fuels to help the factory running. Trees, Which are to take in carbon dioxide aka CO2, And produce oxygen which we need to breathe and survive. Unfortunately, As the population has grown bigger and bigger, Especially during the baby boom area we have cut down more trees to build buildings such as homes and office spaces to keep up with the population. As we keep cutting down more trees and building more factories, Having more gas-powered vehicles on the road, It severely increases how much Co2 in stuck air. Enginers, Scientist, Business Leaders have all joined forces to address the issues. While we have not found a way to stop it completely. This is the one and the only planet we have. However, For centuries we have to practice the same harmful effects on the environment. Treating all life on Earth. While a 1-degree difference in the average temperature may not seem as bad, It can have destsating effects that include water storages that have started happening. It important that we take action now Sources: https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=gBLQUplzZZo&feature=emb_rel_pause The Atmosphere: Getting a Handle on Carbon Dioxide By Alan Buis, NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=4Uy9b87cYRs&feature=emb_logo Global Temperature Unfortunately, As the population has grown bigger and bigger, Especially during the baby boom area we have cut down more trees to build buildings such as homes and office spaces to keep up with the population. As we keep cutting down more trees and building more factories, Having more gas-powered vehicles on the road, It severely increases how much Co2 in stuck air. Enginers, Scientist, Business Leaders have all joined forces to address the issues. While we have not found a way to stop it completely. This is the one and the only planet we have. However, For centuries we have to practice the same harmful effects on the environment. Treating all life on Earth. While a 1-degree difference in the average temperature may not seem as bad, It can have destsating effects that include water storages that have started happening. It important that we take action now Sources: https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=gBLQUplzZZo&feature=emb_rel_pause The Atmosphere: Getting a Handle on Carbon Dioxide By Alan Buis, NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=4Uy9b87cYRs&feature=emb_logo Global Temperature Change Bloomberg Green https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=bpa0aFY--pE&feature=emb_rel_pause https://www. Youtube. Com/watch? V=A5ir8AjmRWQ&feature=emb_rel_pause

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-Change-is-a-real-issue/1/
  • PRO

    The most glaring flaw in this concept is that CCS...

    CCS will take far too long to implement for climate change

    Rainforest Action Network, an environmental non-profit organization, stated the following in a fact sheet on its website titled "The Dirty Truth about Clean Coal," available at www.ran.org (accessed Sep. 17, 2009): "The concept of CCS is that we can curb climate change by capturing the emissions from coal plants and store them underground, safely away from our atmosphere for eternity. The most glaring flaw in this concept is that CCS technology is not likely to be a commercially viable option for at least another decade, and new coal-fired plants are slated to begin construction now. There are also no working models of CCS at a commercial-scale power plant anywhere in the world."

    • http://www.debatepedia.org/en/index.php/Debate:_Carbon_capture_and_storage
  • PRO

    You have to disprove my statement using logic and not...

    Climate change and global warming are both total nonsense and drivel concepts.

    This is a debate. You have to disprove my statement using logic and not supply some totally irrelevant analogy from the Amazon. You are in breach of the laws of physics here. You are supporting a bunch of climate nincompoop criminals who have huge egos that think they can control the Earth's climate by their words and actions. Humans are like ants and the climate is an elephant. A weather front is 5, 000 kilometres in length in most cases. What are they going to do to stop a weather front? Are they going to erect some wind mills blowing in the opposite direction? Lol

  • PRO

    The first one, about that Maurice guy, does not provide...

    Reserved for FollowerofChrist: Climate change is real and a massive threat to humanity.

    No, your first two references do not show anything. The first one, about that Maurice guy, does not provide any kind of sourcing, and therefore cannot be taken seriously. It's basically just a bunch of had hominem calling him and his sister marxists and what not, with the whole point being "he created all of global warming in order to make a new world order". Yeah. The second one, in which "1000" (It's actually 24) scientists are quoted as saying that they don't believe in The first one, about that Maurice guy, does not provide any kind of sourcing, and therefore cannot be taken seriously. It's basically just a bunch of had hominem calling him and his sister marxists and what not, with the whole point being "he created all of global warming in order to make a new world order". Yeah. The second one, in which "1000" (It's actually 24) scientists are quoted as saying that they don't believe in climate science. This, of course, is just a massive appeal to authority fallacy. False Information What?! You know you can't just say "that's not true" and then have something not be true, right? Climate change poses a threat to humanity Here: http://www.greenpeace.org... Here: http://www.greenpeace.org...; Aaaand here: http://www.who.int...; Earth Self Regulates Where'd you get that from? The graphs obviously show that the temperature has not stayed level, so this point is just misinformation. "Hockey stick is broken" No it isn't, ya silly: https://www.skepticalscience.com... "CO2 increase doesn't affect temperature." *sigh* Graphs. What even is this point. It talks about radiation, then some arbitrary distance, then shortening that arbitrary difference, then talks about how distance =/= temperature (reasonable), and finally throws out some arbitrary percentage to top it all off.

CON

  • CON

    Round one does not mean anything If someone wants con...

    Climate change is Manmade

    Round one does not mean anything If someone wants con they can leave a comment and I will let them have Con I just created this so we can start the debate, the con/pro side can type something random and round 2 is the opening statement Rules: Format Pro Opening statement Con Opening Statement Pro questions Con Answers Con questions Pro Answers Pro closing Con closing

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-change-is-Manmade/1/
  • CON

    I would like to thank my opponent for setting up this...

    Climate Change Exists

    I would like to thank my opponent for setting up this challenge. I will be playing devil's advocate.

    • https://www.debate.org/debates/Climate-Change-Exists/1/
  • CON

    The propaganda issued by the IPCC in respect to 97% of...

    The political science of climate change

    The propaganda issued by the IPCC in respect to 97% of scientists believing in AGW is nothing but a very successful attempt to strike fear into gullible people so they will fall in line willingly with Agenda 21. This is the science of creating green guilt, nothing more. Global warming is a term used by the modern eugenicists to reduce the population of people they see as fat, overconsuming planetary destroyers, aka Americans. Meanwhile they transfer American wealth to overpopulated countries in the name of humanitarianism, while the middle class in America gets destroyed. AGW believers are nothing but minions of the globalist elite who are using their wealth to suffocate freedom so they can have the very small population of elitists they so desire. Are you on board with Agenda 21?

  • CON

    Human emissions account for 37 gigatons per annum. ......

    Climate change and global warming are both total nonsense and drivel concepts.

    I'm happy, Although slightly bewildered, By the chance to take this debate. I'll address, Right off the bat, That there are a few minor issues with the opinion of the opposing debator. He starts with some minor claims such as: Volcanoes release 1000 times more Co2 then humans could hope to release. This is. . . Absurdly inaccurate. Current estimates by the United States Geological Survey, Which tracks all global Volcanic activity, Estimates the total amount of Co2 released by volcanoes per year to be 0. 44 gigatons per annum. Human emissions account for 37 gigatons per annum. Natural emissions, About 15 Gigatons per annum. Sulfur and other atmospheric conditions are temporary, As can be seen by the "mini ice age" which lasted for seven. Greenhouse gasses, As far as we can tell, Are nearly permament. Humanity is not a small presence, Even as our individual presence is small. A slime mold on a ball, No matter how large each cell compared to the ball, Effects the surface. According to a recent article by Scientific American, Human CO2 emissions are roughly equal to emissions as burning down the entirety of Africa, Every single year. Or an equivalent amount of CO2 emissions produced by 1700 Mt St. Helena eruptions, Again, Per annum. Greenhouse gasses are trace, Yes, But trace gasses, Including CO2, Do not need high concentrations to reach dangerous effects in an atmosphere that goes up for 70 kilometers and traps gigajoules of heat from the sun. Greenhouse gasses, As well as albedo, Are driving forces for temperature on the surface. As far as well can tell, The greenhouse gasses are higher then they were 10 million years before, As obtained by rock and ice core samples. It's been well established by modelling and atmospheric infrared experimentation, That most of the Human emissions account for 37 gigatons per annum. Natural emissions, About 15 Gigatons per annum. Sulfur and other atmospheric conditions are temporary, As can be seen by the "mini ice age" which lasted for seven. Greenhouse gasses, As far as we can tell, Are nearly permament. Humanity is not a small presence, Even as our individual presence is small. A slime mold on a ball, No matter how large each cell compared to the ball, Effects the surface. According to a recent article by Scientific American, Human CO2 emissions are roughly equal to emissions as burning down the entirety of Africa, Every single year. Or an equivalent amount of CO2 emissions produced by 1700 Mt St. Helena eruptions, Again, Per annum. Greenhouse gasses are trace, Yes, But trace gasses, Including CO2, Do not need high concentrations to reach dangerous effects in an atmosphere that goes up for 70 kilometers and traps gigajoules of heat from the sun. Greenhouse gasses, As well as albedo, Are driving forces for temperature on the surface. As far as well can tell, The greenhouse gasses are higher then they were 10 million years before, As obtained by rock and ice core samples. It's been well established by modelling and atmospheric infrared experimentation, That most of the climate shifts on earth, Ranging from the ice age, To the Jurassic era, When the arctic had a temperate climate, Were the result of CO2. Doubling the amount of these trace gasses is not a light matter.

  • CON

    Further, 8 of these 13 USGCRP senior scientists...

    Climate denial is unusual in the scientific community

    Mr. Merrill's opening statement shows, rightly, what I have said and shown, multiple times, in this debate: There is uncertainty. Mr. Merrill's reply here is also a Logical Fallacy: Red Herring. He is no longer dealing with facts but opinion: ignoring the heart of the discussion; what do the FACTS, or the DATA say? "What do we KNOW", not "who agrees with whom". Uncertainty: AR5 Final Draft, Chapter 9, page 5/205: "The majority of Earth System models now include an interactive representation of aerosols... uncertainties in sulphur-cycle processes and natural sources and sinks remain and so, for example, the simulated aerosol optical depth over oceans ranges from 0.08 to 0.22 with roughly equal numbers of models over- and underestimating the satellite-estimated value of 0.12." From page 27: "By contrast, there is limited evidence that the hiatus in GMST trend has been accompanied by a slower rate of increase in ocean heat content over the depth range 0"700 m, when comparing the period 2003"2010 against 1971"2010. There is low agreement on this slowdown, since three of five analyses show a slowdown in the rate of increase while the other two show the increase continuing unabated (Section 3.2.3, Figure 3.2)." Also, from Chapter 9: "During the 15-year period beginning in 1998, the ensemble of HadCRUT4 GMST trends lies below almost all model-simulated trends (Box 9.2 Figure 1a), whereas during the 15-year period ending in 1998, it lies above 93 out of 114 modelled trends ((Box 9.2 Figure 1b; HadCRUT4 ensemble-mean trend 0.26"C per decade, CMIP5 ensemble-mean trend 0.16"C per decade)." Where are these "uncertainties" in the final report? There is ONE: SPM-10: "There are, however, differences between simulated and observed trends over periods as short as 10 to 15 years." Then there is Kevin Trenberth, head of the Climate Analysis Section at the US National Center for Atmospheric Research, "The fact is that we can"t account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can"t." Former and current IPCC experts who have spoken out against the IPCC"s abuse of science include such prominent scientists as: Dr. Richard Lindzen, MIT climate physicist and Alfred P. Sloan Professor of meteorology, Dept. of Earth, Atmospheric and Planetary Sciences; Dr. John Christy, a climatologist of the University of Alabama in Huntsville and NASA; Dr. Lee C. Gerhard, past director and state geologist with the Kansas Geological Society and a senior scientist emeritus of the University of Kansas; Dr. Patrick J. Michaels, former Virginia State climatologist, a UN IPCC reviewer, and University of Virginia professor of environmental sciences; Dr. Vincent Gray, New Zealand chemist and climate researcher; Dr. Tom V. Segalstad, geologist/geochemist, head of the Geological Museum in Norway; Dr. John T. Everett, a former National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) senior manager and project manager for the UN Atlas of the Oceans. Not to mention, it appears a great many of scientists are "skeptical": http://goo.gl... Secondly, a good number of scientists violate Mr. Merrill's stated ideal, "Far from being alarmists"... Many scientists are involved in AGW Alarmist Activism: Of the 13 senior scientists who put together USGCRP"s January 2013 draft report, seven have ties to activist groups such as the Union of Concerned Scientists and the World Wildlife Fund. Chair Jerry Melillo is a contributing author for the Union of Concerned Scientists. Vice Chair Gary Yohe is part of the World Wildlife Fund (WWF) Climate Witness Program. Richard Moss is a former vice president for WWF. James Buizer is on the Board of Directors of the environmental activist group Second Nature. Susanne Moser is a former staff scientist for the Union of Concerned Scientists. Andrew Rosenberg is a director for the Union of Concerned Scientists. Donald Weubbles is an author for the Union of Concerned Scientists. Further, 8 of these 13 USGCRP senior scientists participate in the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC). See also: http://dotearth.blogs.nytimes.com... "Con presumed that because he could provide nine links..." I'll stop you there. Logical Fallacy: Straw Man. I provided several links that showed mistakes that have been made as ONE of several evidences that Climate Alarmism is wrong. "This is Con"s argument that because climate fluctuations occur naturally, they cannot result from human activity." Logical Fallacy: Straw Man. My position is, and has been, about climate alarmism. I have provided a great many links and sources that show the NATURAL variations in climate, the NATURAL responses of the earth to increased CO2 and the LACK of evidence for AGW affecting earth's climate and or being "out of the ordinary". There is no crisis. "If Con agrees with the Greenhouse Theory as he so surely claims, he cannot deny that significant increases in CO2 stand to boost global temperature." I don't have to deny it. What you have engaged in is known as the Common Cause Fallacy or False Cause: http://goo.gl... http://goo.gl... This one has the graphs: http://goo.gl... Then Mr. Merrill provides several "proofs" by listing statements from some of the organizations that have bought in to the AGW Alarmism. Lets look at the other side and what they say: A few members of organizations like the AMS have left over the AMS's stand on AGW: http://goo.gl... A poll taken on Meteorologists show them to be skeptics: http://goo.gl... And if you don't "toe the line", you have your credentials threatened: http://goo.gl... "billions of us will die and the few breeding pairs of people that survive will be in the Arctic where the climate remains tolerable." (2006) -- James Lovelock, British inventor, NASA scientist, author, and originator of the Gaia Hypothesis, He now says his predictions were "alarmist," and he criticizes his former comrades for having turned environmentalism into a "green religion." http://goo.gl... "For many years, I was an active supporter of the IPCC and its CO2 theory... Recent experience with the UN"s climate panel, however, forced me to reassess my position. In February 2010, I was invited as a reviewer for the IPCC report on renewable energy. I realised that the drafting of the report was done in anything but a scientific manner. The report was littered with errors and a member of Greenpeace edited the final version. These developments shocked me. I thought, if such things can happen in this report, then they might happen in other IPCC reports too." -- Professor Fritz Vahrenholt, author, "Die Kalte Sonne (The Cold Sun)", co-authored with noted geologist/paleontologist Dr. Sebastian L"ning. http://goo.gl... "Any reasonable scientific analysis must conclude the basic theory wrong!!" " NASA Scientist Dr. Leonard Weinstein who worked 35 years at the NASA Langley Research Center and finished his career there as a Senior Research Scientist. Weinstein is presently a Senior Research Fellow at the National Institute of Aerospace http://goo.gl... "Please remain calm: The Earth will heal itself " Climate is beyond our power to control"Earth doesn't care about governments or their legislation. You can"t find much actual global warming in present-day weather observations. Climate change is a matter of geologic time, something that the earth routinely does on its own without asking anyone"s permission or explaining itself." " Nobel Prize-Winning Stanford University Physicist Dr. Robert B. Laughlin, who won the Nobel Prize for physics in 1998, and was formerly a research scientist at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory. http://goo.gl... "Hundreds of billion dollars have been wasted with the attempt of imposing a Anthropogenic Global Warming (AGW) theory that is not supported by physical world evidences"AGW has been forcefully imposed by means of a barrage of scare stories and indoctrination that begins in the elementary school textbooks." " Brazilian Geologist Geraldo Lu"s Lino, -- "The Global Warming Fraud: How a Natural Phenomenon Was Converted into a False World Emergency." 2009. "[The science] community is relying on an inadequate model to blame CO2 and innocent citizens for global warming in order to generate funding and to gain attention. If this is what "science" has become today, I, as a scientist, am ashamed." " Research Chemist William C. Gilbert published a study in August 2010 in the journal Energy & Environment titled "The thermodynamic relationship between surface temperature and water vapor concentration in the troposphere" and he published a paper in August 2009 titled "Atmospheric Temperature Distribution in a Gravitational Field." "[The global warming establishment] has actively suppressed research results presented by researchers that do not comply with the dogma of the IPCC." " Swedish Climatologist Dr. Hans Jelbring, of the Paleogeophysics & Geodynamics Unit at Stockholm University "There is a lack of willingness in the climate change community to steer away from groupthink" They are setting themselves up as second-rate scientists by not engaging... They will tolerate no dissent and seek to trample anyone who challenges them... The IPCC assessment process had a substantial element of schoolyard bullies, trying to insulate their shoddy science from outside scrutiny and attacks by skeptics"the IPCC and its conclusions were set on a track to become a self fulfilling prophecy." -- Dr. Judith Curry, the chair of Earth & Atmospheric Sciences at GA Institute of Tech http://goo.gl... "In attributing warming to man, they fail to point out that the warming has been small, and totally consistent with there being nothing to be alarmed about." -- Richard Lindzen, Former UN IPCC Lead Author http://goo.gl... http://goo.gl... http://goo.gl... http://goo.gl... http://goo.gl...

  • CON

    Pro thinks that if you spend money towards climate, it...

    Money should be spend more on climate crisis than on military force

    Pro thinks that if you spend money towards climate, it will solve the issue. There is one BIG thing Pro is not thinking of. If we somehow get the entire world to lay down their arms then that is just dandy. However, that will happen. We need to protect ourself. Dropping the military budget will only make things worse. Not only that but it would be slowing down the thing that might happen anyway. Pro then lists some Al Gore qoutes, which he doesn't build on. Miltary is more useful then climate change.

  • CON

    The countries where zero, slow, or NO growth are rich,...

    Population control MUST be part of climate change/sustainable policies

    I apoligize for the varying (and abnormally large)sizes of graphs and charts ahead of time. Figure 1. The first graph depicts the population of Earth over time. s://lh6.googleusercontent.com...; alt="" width="624px;" height="396px;" /> As we can see in the graph, the world is not on the path of out of control population growth, in fact, population growth has been on the decline. Notice how this occured without any major population control methods. Figure 2. This chart depicts fertility rates in certain countries. s://lh3.googleusercontent.com...; alt="" width="575px;" height="317px;" /> Why is this graph significant? It depicts the countries that are experiencing population growth. The countries where zero, slow, or NO growth are rich, "developed", states such as the US and Germany. The countries with high fertility rates are countries where poverty is rampant and birth control/women's rights are almost non-existent.Thus,larger population growth rates in the Third World are a consequence of dire poverty and restrictions on women’s ability to control their own fertility The latest UN population report released on March 12 predicts population will exceed 9 billion people by mid-century. Almost all of this growth will occur in the global South. The 49 poorest countries in the world will have by far the biggest increases. In the richest countries, however, population will decline from 1.23 billion to 1.15 billion if projected net migration is left aside. (It will increase to only 1.28 billion including net migration). Raising living standards globally, improving health care, providing access to education and achieving greater equality for women, creates a stable population growth, without the artificial constraints of population control. Unfortunately, you address the issue of The countries where zero, slow, or NO growth are rich, "developed", states such as the US and Germany. The countries with high fertility rates are countries where poverty is rampant and birth control/women's rights are almost non-existent.Thus,larger population growth rates in the Third World are a consequence of dire poverty and restrictions on women’s ability to control their own fertility The latest UN population report released on March 12 predicts population will exceed 9 billion people by mid-century. Almost all of this growth will occur in the global South. The 49 poorest countries in the world will have by far the biggest increases. In the richest countries, however, population will decline from 1.23 billion to 1.15 billion if projected net migration is left aside. (It will increase to only 1.28 billion including net migration). Raising living standards globally, improving health care, providing access to education and achieving greater equality for women, creates a stable population growth, without the artificial constraints of population control. Unfortunately, you address the issue of climate change in your argument, without considering the implications of population control. An article by Simon Butler summarizes it perfectly: “In practice, there has never been a population control scheme that has met with acceptable environmental or humanitarian outcomes. Columbia University professor Matthew Connelly has thoroughly documented this disturbing history in his 2008 book Fatal Misconception.[9] China’s one child policy has been hailed as an environmental measure by prominent population theorists such as Britain’s Jonathan Poritt.[10] But he and others ignore that China’s population control has hardly solved that country’s growing environmental problems. The human costs of the policy, however, are shocking. Until 2002 Chinese women were denied any choice of contraceptive method – 37% of married women have been forcibly sterilized.[11] Female infanticide has reached epidemic proportions” How can you guarantee the rights of others are not infringed in this process? Who “controls” birth? The government? And who will be in place to decide how to even control population? Many are against birth control, and obviously murder. I await your response.

  • CON

    would be posted on the Internet, open to the public (else...

    Governments should require that funded climate data be posted

    Pro states that I have not addressed his three points but, instead, introduced two negative contentions. But, according to Pro, "The full resolution is: 'In all countries, governments should impose a condition on climate research grants and aid related to climate research that source data collected or analyzed under the grant, and all software developed under the government support shall be posted on the Internet within one month of publication or announcement of the results by any means.'...the full resolution is the one to debate." By refuting the negative results that most likely would result were the resolution be adopted, I have refuted the entire premise of the resolution and have thus responded to the debate challenge. To argue the results of what has NOT been done in no way validates Pros predictions of what would result if the resolution were adopted. Therefore I have properly addressed the resolution with complete and correct arguments against the resolution. Perhaps I am misreading the resolution but what I see is that once a finding is published or "announced by any means," within 1 month the source (I read this as "Raw") data that was collected or analyzed (wouldn't analyzed data also have to have been collected?) would be posted on the Internet, open to the public (else how would the "public" know what it is they are getting for their money?) apparently unabridged. To assume this would eliminate (or even curtail) errors and/or ambiguous data or skewed results is pure conjecture and unsupported. Would that this data and the software used were made available to all bona fide investigators, meaning scientists, researchers and technicians employed by or actively engaged in climate-change research for peer review and co-operative research, with Penalties for releasing information prior to peer review and consensus under the umbrella of National Security (since, indeed, the security of the nation is at stake based upon the path we take in response to the question of global climate change) then I believe a better understanding would be possible than placing the future of our country in the hands of the pundits who, admittedly (or not) have their own agendas. If all communications between parties engaged in climate-change research were to be made public, free and uninhibited discourse between these parties would be severely curtailed. Although it is impossible to secure e-mail 100%, it should still be considered as private or even as protected as "snail mail" or the verbal conversation of which it is replacing and not subject to public scrutiny. No one doubts that every instance of computer software is without possible flaws, or glitches, but to recreate identical results from identical data requires more than just a copy of the software. One has to duplicate perfectly the entry of that data and the parameters surrounding the software within the specific computer as well as being equally conversant in the operation of the software as its creator. This is especially true of software that is targeted toward a specific problem (analyzing and modeling climate change data within certain parameters) rather than "vanilla" software (such as a word processor or graphics generator) that will eventually be used in many divergent applications by many users. Most software designers, as well as most scientists, I understand, are a proud group, who feel insulted by uninformed criticism upon their work by pundits who are not conversant in the field in which their attacks are directed. To expose this work or product to public scrutiny, rather than limiting it to peer review, is to place unjustified pressure on these professionals to limit their research to "non-controversial" areas or to withhold crucial data to avoid unwarranted attack or even to "fudge" data to assuage the critics. There is no argument against the public having a right to the PRODUCTS of work paid for by taxpayers. But to insist upon public disclosure of every keystroke and instance of data falling outside of the standard deviation model is to invite equally public defamation of the publishing party as well as "ammunition" by those whose agenda is to disrupt and discredit the entire field of study by any means at their disposal. Again, I aver, there is a direct correlation between public perception of an issue and the amount of money approved to research that issue. While the Congress controls the purse strings, it is the constituency who ultimately control the congress. This, of course, includes that portion of the constituency who have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo, regardless of the long-term effects.

  • CON

    Net/assets/peak-emissions/ If you don't want to accept...

    "Fixing the Climate" should be a Low Priority for the USA

    I didn't rescind the hypothetical. I said there was no specific study to say yet, And commented that such a study with extremely specific numbers is probably not possible. Also, That it is only considering money and not morality, Or even human QoL. Everyone in the science community talks about "A 2C Peak to global temperatures" or "A 4C peak to global temperatures. " I can give you sources for the global temperature cycle, The natural climate change that happens over time to show you there are peaks and valleys if you want. The peak may not every stop if we don't address our effects on the climate. By pumping greenhouses gasses into the atmosphere we are terraforming our planet. I can give you arguments for why pumping large amounts of essentially poison into our atmosphere is also bad for human health. Here's a source that shows you people talking about trying to keep a 2C peak, And how our emissions have to change to achieve that peak. eciu. Net/assets/peak-emissions/ If you don't want to accept that then I can't force you to, But this is what the scientists speak of. The fact is if we keep it at a LOW priority and we don't address it head on, The graph above shows 2C peak will probably be unavoidable after 2040, And if the peak doesn't happen before 2025 we will have to get negative emissions to prevent going over 2C. Most people consider this fairly impossible, But not addressing it would lead us to a 4C world. Perhaps higher. Now, If your claim is that we're all doomed anyway, I guess the US could keep it a low priority. We COULD just accept that the climate is changing, Lay down and die, But your arguments as to why we SHOULD just die fall flat. 2. We set a goal to get to the moon. We didn't KNOW we could. Research was done at a high priority for no better reason than a childish spat with Russia. If we can't get above a low priority for the terraforming of our planet as far as research goes, I can't give you a better justification. What's more critical, Spats with other countries or the instability of our climate? All the scientists are suggesting many ways to pull gasses out of the atmosphere. You're asking us to trust your diagnoses that the probability is LOW but you are no authority in this matter. Even if it IS low, It should be a high priority to avoid a 4C or worse world. You have no argument to oppose this, And you have no argument to oppose the fact that increased research funding would more likely lead to a solution, Or a mitigation, Particularly when so many SCIENTISTS disagree with you. I've linked the Harvard mitigation solution already, What more do you want? It currently seems that unless I'm able to tell you precise numbers for the catastrophe and give you a 100% pure solution prior to research being conducted then your position is that we should all lie down and accept an infinitely warming climate and that it is no big deal. If you call this a LOW priority what are your high or med priorities? -Thoht

  • CON

    At this time, when CO2 increased, is when scientists said...

    Taking a Stand Against Climate Change with Greener Technologies

    Hello, Mac, and I am glad you instigated this debate. My opponent’s arguments rely on three main contentions: 1) Global warming is real and is a threat 2) Global warming is caused by human activity 3) We should attempt to stop global warming I will refute them as follows: 1. Global warming is real and a threat My opponent’s main point here is the expected sea level rise. However, some scientific papers have been released showing the sea level rise has been over predicted and that in many parts of the world, sea level rise isn’t happening at all. The IPCC’s data claiming massive sea level rise has been grossly exaggerated and is utterly incorrect. For example, Bangladesh should have been engulfed in water, or should be seeing significant problems. In 2007, the IPCC proclaimed their doomsday. However recent data shows the sea levels there are not rising [1]. My opponent also forgets the possible benefits of Global Warming. For example, parts of Canada, Russia, and Argentina too cold for industrialization and farming would become reachable. Historically, warmer temperatures in the Northern Hemisphere acted as a benefit for the Vikings. Greenland and Iceland’s productivity rose, the increased rain caused better harvests, and lead to the Vikings making landfall in the New World. The increased CO2 would make plant growth easier and enhance the world, making it muck more habitable. Some of the warmest periods in our history, the world flourished with resources aplenty; a warmer climate could easily be good for you and me [2]. My opponents other point here is the reality of global warming, and here I agree. There has been an overall warming trend since 1850, however I dispute current warming. Global warming stopped in 1997, with an overall decrease in temperature since then. Using NOAA data starting from 2000, to avoid the El Niño year in 1998 (which ‘refutes’ the global warming stopped theory) shows no change. A slight decrease in temperature, although the trend is less. There has been no warming since 1997, and no statistically significant warming since 1995 [3]. 2. Humans are the cause of global warming This is the main contention of the debate; if it is awful, but natural, we can’t stop it: changing our ways of life would be worthless. If it is still happening but is natural, we can’t stop it and changing would, again, be a pointless exercise. So, I explain the reasoning on why claiming humans cause global warming is illogical. First, CO2 and other emissions increase during a good economy. After the 1940’s, a post-war economic boom occurred. At this time, when CO2 increased, is when scientists said humans first began to have a large impact on global warming. Interestingly, temperatures decreased at this time. Alarmists have tried to counter these claims, but their logic fails to hold up [4]. Either way, my opponent has only assumed humans are the main cause of the warming; he has given little evidence himself that we are the cause. Correlation is always an argument in this debate. People have argued there is a strong correlation between CO2 and temperature, however this is simply untrue. CO2 only correlates r= .44, with 1 being perfect and 0 being none at all. This means the correlation rates fair to poor. The sun scores better, with an r= .57, meaning it rates to fair to good. And the PDO correlates the best, with an 0.83 rating good [5]. It seems hard to argue CO2 causes the warming when it fails to correlate to a degree of ‘good’ and its rivals for the title—the sun and the PDO—correlate much better then it. Further, the current warming should have been predicted, as according to Singers 1,500 sun cycle the current warming was right on time. The majority of geologists—about 50%—believe global warming is a natural cycle and the current warming is right on time [6]. Other explanations, like cosmic rays, also seems like a possible factors. In short wording: Humans likely do not play a major role in global warming, although we likely exacerbate the situation a little bit. 3. It should be stopped—specifically with green energy If my opponent wishes to bring up another solution, I am all ears. However he currently argues green energy is the solution. Lets go down the list: a) Wind power There is a simple problem with wind: the fact that wind is not always blowing, and its upfront capital costs more then outweighs the fact that wind, itself, is free. Wind itself has lees value then its fossil fuel competitors and must be placed in areas with constant (or higher then average) wind amounts, limiting its universality. Unlike Fossil fuel plants, which can be planted anywhere. There is other, in my opinion more real, issues then global warming. Wind stations kill the avian populations and take up a lot of space, often ruining natural beauty. Many rodents actually like the wind farms and live inside the fan. Rodents—a food source for many predators—get killed trying to eat them. And, obviously, other birds will fly through the places and get whacked and die. Some Wind projects take 10 billion pounds of raw materials. If we assume global warming is man made, the CO2 created by the mining and construction often times shrinks the overall benefit. b) Solar Potential market chare for solar has been overestimated time and time again and the subsidies that the industry relies on—because it is not competitive with fossil fuel because the marker does not favor it—costs millions of dollars, even more then the Wind subsidies. Thermal solar plants need 1,000 times more the resources fossil fuel plants need. Some studies argue: “Solar Two looks good on paper, and it is expected to provide steady baseload electricity as well as late afternoon peaking capacity, but the future of all the central solar generators is in doubt. They are expensive to build, their very scale escalates financial risks--as with nuclear power--and their massive height (in excess of 200 meters) may attract opposition.”[7] Other Solar industries (there are many) require millions of dollars to operate and to even be on the market and commercialize their products. Many environmentalists have a actually given up on some solar markets, like photovoltaic, in favor of nuclear (something they usually despise) because of the destruction of those solar plants. c) Hydro Even environmentalists have left hydro power, uttering the power source in the same breath as they do natural gas, coal, and nuclear. From a conservative standpoint, the construction of Hydro power is actually very invasive on the surrounding community and cost millions. On a more liberal note, the hydro plants take a lot of resources to build and kill and disturb many fish populations. The cost of current hydro plants are 5-6 times more expensive per kilowatt hour then other fossil fuels. d) Case study: Michigan There has been no net job growth because of their green energy, they have created jobs in one sector but have taken them away from another. Their energy prices have increased and their prices continue to increase. Other states, like North Dakota, have welcomed fossil fuels and have had a net job growth and prices fall. Studies have shown for every one job created in their oil industry, another three are created because of decreased energy costs [8]. CONCLUSION: I have proven my opponents premises to be incorrect and his solution of green energy is impractical, harmful to the economy, and, sometimes, not even green. (longest url's shortened to make room) 1. http://tinyurl.com...; 2. http://www.stanford.edu... 3. http://wattsupwiththat.com... 4. http://tinyurl.com...; 5. http://wattsupwiththat.com... 6. MacRae, Paul. False Alarm: Global Warming-- Facts versus Fears. Victoria, B.C.: Spring Bay, 2010. Print. 7. http://www.cato.org... 8. http://www.heritage.org...